European Championships

[Silver Fox]

The BBC will showing the European Championships live on their red button interactive service from Monday 9th August.

[Steve]

Also on Eurosport for those who need to record it while at work (like me!)

The BBC have it on BBC2/3 for Saturday and Sunday.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/other_sports/swimming/7736021.stm

[Silver Fox]

European Championship Website Service Temporarily Unavailable
The server is temporarily unable to service your request due to maintenance downtime or capacity problems. Please try again later.
That's a good start!

[Silver Fox]

Go to Omegatiming.com for results

[Gina]

I always go to Omegatiming.com for the results and live timing.

Some good swims so far. Impressed with the French guys as usual. The 100m backstrokers looked too easy and went 53s. Donets won the Russian 2nd place swim off in a 53 so Liam has his work cut out for him to medal possibly. The relay team, without their fastest went 3.13 which, 2 years ago, would have been close to the WR. Agnel and Bernard should come in for the final and knock a few seconds off that time.

Our 200m backstroke girls looked good and are 1st and 2nd into the semi. My teammate Katy Avramova finished a tenth off her best but qualified 15th and so she gets a second swim tonight. Good luck to her.

Amy Smith swam a 54.7 to lead out the 4x100 freestyle relay which is fast and the girls qualified comfortably for the final in 3rd.

[Steve]

I always go to Omegatiming.com for the results and live timing.

Some good swims so far. Impressed with the French guys as usual. The 100m backstrokers looked too easy and went 53s. Donets won the Russian 2nd place swim off in a 53 so Liam has his work cut out for him to medal possibly. The relay team, without their fastest went 3.13 which, 2 years ago, would have been close to the WR. Agnel and Bernard should come in for the final and knock a few seconds off that time.

Our 200m backstroke girls looked good and are 1st and 2nd into the semi. My teammate Katy Avramova finished a tenth off her best but qualified 15th and so she gets a second swim tonight. Good luck to her.

Amy Smith swam a 54.7 to lead out the 4x100 freestyle relay which is fast and the girls qualified comfortably for the final in 3rd.
Will Jo Jackson stay in the team for the final? I couldn't think of anyone who might come in to take her place - looked a little off the pace this morning based on her split - 56 point.

[lidoswimmer]

Watching it now :-)
Is it really that hard to peak / taper for two major championships in a year ? Our British swimmers seem to be swimming the Europeans unrested And aiming for the Commonwealths ??

[lidoswimmer]

Hanna Miley swam well though just now! Gold 400IM 4:33.09
Are some British swimmers tapered then??

[lane 2]

The commentator is driving me nuts!

[Apostle]

The commentator is driving me nuts!

Me too! I know the proper comms are down but this guy is useless.

[FinswimmerJohn]

This just in via the BBC.
I guess she'll now be "Smiley Miley"...;-o

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/other_sports/swimming/8898689.stm

[Gina]

Me too! I know the proper comms are down but this guy is useless.

I switched from Eurosport to BBCi as he was getting so annoying. Saying the Hungarian had pretty much won the 400 IM after 200m when Miley had her 2 best strokes to come. He then went on to say the French guy had won the 100 breaststroke when it was only the semi.

Nice swim from Dale Oen (who I can confirm does do LC training!!) and the GB girls in the 200 back. Awesome swim from Lacourt in the 100 back, he looked so smooth and powerful.

Lastly thanks to the BBC commentator for the Ealing shout out when Katy Avramova was swimming. She just missed out of a final place but did a 1.5 second PB.

[lane 2]

......and didn't he say he was the fastest qualifier in 1 minute 79 seconds??????????????

[Steve]

The commentator is driving me nuts!
Isn't it Drew and Mark Foster on Eurosport (it was this morning)? Are they the ones annoying people? Not sure why James Parrack isn't doing it.

And I retract my comment about Jo Jackson from earlier - if only we had two of Fran Halsall though!

[Apostle]

I switched from Eurosport to BBCi as he was getting so annoying. Saying the Hungarian had pretty much won the 400 IM after 200m when Miley had her 2 best strokes to come. He then went on to say the French guy had won the 100 breaststroke when it was only the semi.

Nice swim from Dale Oen (who I can confirm does do LC training!!) and the GB girls in the 200 back. Awesome swim from Lacourt in the 100 back, he looked so smooth and powerful.

Lastly thanks to the BBC commentator for the Ealing shout out when Katy Avramova was swimming. She just missed out of a final place but did a 1.5 second PB.

Haha. Yeah i thought that in the im. How can he possibly know the result after half the race. Saying that apparently the leader at the time was the european record holder. I only have his word for that.

Poor swim from liam tancock i thought who did not seem to see the threat of missing out and thought he would get through in a fast heat.

[Apostle]

Isn't it Drew and Mark Foster on Eurosport (it was this morning)? Are they the ones annoying people? Not sure why James Parrack isn't doing it.

And I retract my comment about Jo Jackson from earlier - if only we had two of Fran Halsall though!

Drew and mark were there for about 15 mins and then there seemed to be a technical issue and the moron who was only the introducer of the programme took over.

He also said we could look forward to the mens 400 freestyle when had seen it no more than 5 minutes earlier.

[NotVeryFast]

Watching it now :-)
Is it really that hard to peak / taper for two major championships in a year ? Our British swimmers seem to be swimming the Europeans unrested And aiming for the Commonwealths ??
If the 2 events are 6 months apart, no problem, but there's no way you can truly peak for an event just 2 months after a full taper for another.

[Gina]

I have no idea what goes on in the French men's relay but they never produce when they really need to. I will say this though ... I feel the French men's team should win the Medley relay but I wouldn't bet on it as the Russians have a strong team too. It just depends on who they put in the team.

[lane 2]

Liam Tancock has made the final of 100 back due to a withdrawal.

[Leprechaun]

I have no idea what goes on in the French men's relay but they never produce when they really need to.

A nation of sporting "bottlers", capable of ensuring that which afflicts the Dutch football team can be dispersed throughout any sporting team they put together. Plenty of great individuals in many sports, but teams - evidemment "non" mon amie.
:joker::joker:

[HaggisBasher]

very poor swims from the British girls in Breaststroke this morning!

At least Bushell scored some vital 'Team' pionts last week in all of her events contested?

[Apostle]

None of the swimmers, except hannah miley, has set europe alight here so far. But thats understandable if they are fkucsing on cwg. They will not be tapered for this meet.

[Odmaster]

I switched from Eurosport to BBCi as he was getting so annoying. Saying the Hungarian had pretty much won the 400 IM after 200m when Miley had her 2 best strokes to come. He then went on to say the French guy had won the 100 breaststroke when it was only the semi.

Nice swim from Dale Oen (who I can confirm does do LC training!!) and the GB girls in the 200 back. Awesome swim from Lacourt in the 100 back, he looked so smooth and powerful.

Lastly thanks to the BBC commentator for the Ealing shout out when Katy Avramova was swimming. She just missed out of a final place but did a 1.5 second PB.


I agree - BBCi has much the better presentation!!

Slightly unrelated question - why do the French women (and I noticed a Spanish swimmer yesterday) all wear hats that leave their forehead exposed. Laure Manidou (spelling?) seemed to start the trend. My hats all come right down to the top of my eyebrows...is it a European thing or have they just all got big foreheads???????

[swimmer770]

I can't understand why all the commentators are saying that GB arn't tapered and prepared for these championships as they are focusing on Commies in Oct. Surely a European Title is what they would aim for? Im sure there would be a lot of younger stars that would of loved to of gone to these championships.

And as for the commentators.. Persuming they know why people got DQT e.g Kate Haywood when they haven't a clue. Gutting for GB in the Women's Breaststroke. Lets hope they can turn it around in the 50 and 200.

[Breaststrokemum]

Mr Tancock is a very lucky young man!

BM

[lidoswimmer]

I simply cant understand some of our better known swimmers swimming here untapered, with their eyes on the Commonwealths, simply 'going through the motions'... Surely better to send our less experienced up and coming youngsters to get in some vital experience in with London 2012 fast approaching...
Well done Hanna and Lizzie ! Some can taper for Europeans AND Commonwealths then...

[NotVeryFast]

I can't understand why all the commentators are saying that GB arn't tapered and prepared for these championships as they are focusing on Commies in Oct. Surely a European Title is what they would aim for?
I think you can get a good measure of the relative status of the two events by looking at the TV coverage. Europeans - hidden away on the red button. Commonwealths - surely will have almost blanket coverage on the main channels. I think you'll get a lot more casual viewers watching the swimming when the Commonwealths are on, whereas only pure swimming fans will bother watching the Europeans.

Well done Hanna and Lizzie ! Some can taper for Europeans AND Commonwealths then...
Hannah and Lizzie won't have tapered, it's just that some swimmers can do better unrested than others. I can go through the maths of why it's physically impossible to taper then get your body back into the same state 2 months later if you want?

[Linny]

I think you can get a good measure of the relative status of the two events by looking at the TV coverage. Europeans - hidden away on the red button. Commonwealths - surely will have almost blanket coverage on the main channels. I think you'll get a lot more casual viewers watching the swimming when the Commonwealths are on, whereas only pure swimming fans will bother watching the Europeans.Pretty sure it's money, not the status of the meet as decided by television coverage that determines the target meet for the season, which is why our athletes were focussed on their Europeans.

[lidoswimmer]

Hannah and Lizzie won't have tapered, it's just that some swimmers can do better unrested than others. I can go through the maths of why it's physically impossible to taper then get your body back into the same state 2 months later if you want?

No maths needed thank you Nvf :-)
just shows what class acts Hanna and Lizzie are if they can win Golds unrested... I take my swim hat off to the two young ladies...

[Gina]

I think the Commies are the bigger meet for a few reasons ... the first being that we get to swim against the Australians, Canadians and South Africans to name the big countries in the Commonwealth. Also it is the second of the two meets so our swimmers can use Europeans as a prep meet for the Commies in October. Also as we are taking swimmers for 3 different countries we should have a larger GB team in India compared to Hungary. Just my thoughts.

Also if we'd taken a second team then we might have more juniors going to Europeans which have come right after Youth nationals and also European Juniors in mid July. They would have been knackered!!

[Gina]

Oh and can someone explain to me what happened in the men's 200 free?? In one of the semis there were 9 guys racing instead of the normal 8 but I didn't hear any reason for this.

[GettingFaster]

It did get a fairly long mention on Radio 4 this morning, so I suspect Mr Ballard is probably poking around the sports desk making sure swimming gets a look-in - well done that man! ;)

[The ROCK]

I can go through the maths of why it's physically impossible to taper then get your body back into the same state 2 months later if you want?

..................is that a fact or an opinion? Only given that there is a Trials meet for the English Commonwealth Games Team next week it strikes me that either the powers that be know something you don't or vice versa?!

[NotVeryFast]

..................is that a fact or an opinion? Only given that there is a Trials meet for the English Commonwealth Games Team next week it strikes me that either the powers that be know something you don't or vice versa?!
If you believe that the Banister impulse response model of the effect of training on the human body is valid, and there has been a fair bit of validation of it, then yes, you can do the maths with the model to show that you just can't get back to where you were in that short a space of time.

The thing about trials close to meets isn't so much based on a belief that athletes can do a full taper for trials and then also for the meet itself, it's more about picking the people with good current form. So if you want to allow the athletes to do 2x full tapers, you need the trials well away from the meet, and GB has certainly used this approach on many occasions in recent years. The problem is that a lot can happen in between the two tapers. The USA always hold their trials quite close to the meet because they have found this gives the best results at the meet, but it's important to realise that they're talking about the best results for the team, not the best performances by individuals. The best swimmers, such as Phelps, can cope with it, because they don't need to be 100% at the trials to qualify, so you typically see him do better at the proper meet than at trials. People who are going to struggle to qualify have more of a problem, and may well end up with compromised performance at the proper meet, but the research suggests this is nonetheless preferable to the risk of a big change in form from trials held much longer before the meet. However I'm not convinced that if the USA repeated their research today they would necessarily reach the same conclusion, as the competitive environment has changed significantly since they did their research.

[selkie]

Hannah and Lizzie won't have tapered, it's just that some swimmers can do better unrested than others. I can go through the maths of why it's physically impossible to taper then get your body back into the same state 2 months later if you want?

It also depends on the training program. Some coaches, especially ones that emphasize long training distances, will typically have a lot bigger gap between mid-season form and taper form compared to other coaches who see swimmers go better mid-season and then drop less. The Florida swimmers come to mind as horrible mid-season swimmers, and if Gemma Spofforth's just back from there, then the 2:07 really is an excellent time that bodes well for later.

[Neversink]

The BBC will showing the European Championships live on their red button interactive service from Monday 9th August.



What channel is this and how do you get on to it?

I am trying to write a post about the European championships and I have no idea when it is on (what time) and how to get on to the BBC red button interactive service???

Can anyone help me please???? Thank you.

Sinky xx

[Silver Fox]

BBC 1 at 4pm click on the red button...be warned that it does not come on until just a few minutes before 4pm...SF

[Neversink]

BBC 1 at 4pm click on the red button...be warned that it does not come on until just a few minutes before 4pm...SF

Thanks silver fox, and what time is it on tomorrow morning and evening?

[Silver Fox]

As far as I know the morning heats cannot be seen on the red button...the semi's and finals will be on at the same time at 4pm...I trust you know where to obtain results... www.omegatiming.com...SF

[adamlelean]

As far as I know the morning heats cannot be seen on the red button...the semi's and finals will be on at the same time at 4pm...I trust you know where to obtain results... www.omegatiming.com...SF

The electronic program guide say:
channel 301
Today and Friday 4:00 pm until 6:00 pm
Thursday 4:30 pm until 6:00 pm

I have no idea why Thursday is different

[lane4]

Hannah and Lizzie won't have tapered, it's just that some swimmers can do better unrested than others.
Knowing roughly what she does do in training, I'm not sure Hannah ever tapers (in the sense of what most people would call a taper anyway), and I'm not sure Lizzie ever needs a taper. She seems to swim pretty damn well, almost all of the time. This season alone she has swam 2:08 or faster on 6 occasions, including 2:06 twice, once at the BUCS meet in February (presumably a non-taper meet), and again at GB Trials in March (possibly a taper meet but maybe not). Fran Halsall is another one who typically competes fast year round.

[Neversink]

The electronic program guide say:
channel 301
Today and Friday 4:00 pm until 6:00 pm
Thursday 4:30 pm until 6:00 pm

I have no idea why Thursday is different

Thank you!!!! :funnyhat:

[Tewson Veste]

Also on Eurosport and Eurosport HD

[Steve]

Also on Eurosport and Eurosport HD
Including the morning heats at 0830.

And numerous repeats too.

[Alan Rowson]

The electronic program guide say:
channel 301
Today and Friday 4:00 pm until 6:00 pm
Thursday 4:30 pm until 6:00 pm

I have no idea why Thursday is different

It's on BBC2 on thursday afternoon

[Steve]

It's on BBC2 on thursday afternoon
That'll be Adlington then!

[saturdaynighter]

That'll be Adlington then!

Strange scheduling if the start time for this evening's session is the same as normal (5pm).

BBC2 appears to start at 3.00 (4.00 Budapest) - that's one big build-up to the 800m race and not much coverage for the other events/swimmers???

p.s. Budapest is ace - inexpensive, friendly, clean (apart from ''silly little dog'' owners) - fantastic food (if you hunt it down) and the best wine appreciation we've had in a major capital

[littlemonkey]

Strange scheduling if the start time for this evening's session is the same as normal (5pm).

that's one big build-up to the 800m race and not much coverage for the other events/swimmers???


From BBC2 schedule info.....

"Rebecca Adlington is in action in the 800m final and her team-mate Hannah Miley goes for gold in the 200m individual medley. There are also highlights of the first three days of the championships."

Sounds good to me - means the public will get chance to see the fantastic achievements so far from the others in the squad. Ok, it does mean that some of this evening's action wont be shown but I guess it's better than nothing.

[Steve]

I imagine they will switch to the red button at 4:30 once Adders has had her swim.

[saturdaynighter]

From BBC2 schedule info.....

"Rebecca Adlington is in action in the 800m final and her team-mate Hannah Miley goes for gold in the 200m individual medley. There are also highlights of the first three days of the championships."

Sounds good to me - means the public will get chance to see the fantastic achievements so far from the others in the squad. Ok, it does mean that some of this evening's action wont be shown but I guess it's better than nothing.

Fair enough :)

[Apostle]

Fair enough :)

Although eurosport broadcast can be a bit manic at least you get every heat of every race.

[Improving a lot]

Could they not have put an overlap between the bbc2 and red button coverage? Gah! And how rude of Claire to butt in in the middle of commentary. Why not wait til after the 2nd 100 fly semi to cut off? They manage to do it when football overruns. Some good swimming going on though and I am grateful for it to be on earth tv at all!

[lidoswimmer]

Adlington gave a bbc interview before her 800m race saying her confidence had been knocked. Words to the effect, not right yet but getting there...
Cant see why her coach etc gets her to swim this race unrested. She comes way down in the race and is crying at the after race interview. Surely competing when she's not fit cant help her confidence issues... Why swim? Why not just stay home train for the commonwealths that she's being aimed at...

[Linny]

These (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/picturegalleries/7936969/Ripples-and-reflections-underwater-pictures-at-the-European-Swimming-Championships-in-Budapest.html)are good! :D

[GettingFaster]

Those are fantastic pictures, Linny, what a great find!

I do want to correct the caption under picture 20, surely that's breaststroke...?

There are also some diving and synchro pictures in other galleries from the same competition, if anyone's interested. Terrific photos.

[Happi Blue]

Best of luck to Antony James in the 100 fly semi final, qualified in 5th place with 52.86 :)

[adamlelean]

Was it just me or did Simon Burnett glide for the last 1/2 metre of the 100 free. My coach would kill me if I finished 100m race like that. To make matters worse he then missed out on the final by 0.02 of a second.

[Apostle]

Adlington gave a bbc interview before her 800m race saying her confidence had been knocked. Words to the effect, not right yet but getting there...
Cant see why her coach etc gets her to swim this race unrested. She comes way down in the race and is crying at the after race interview. Surely competing when she's not fit cant help her confidence issues... Why swim? Why not just stay home train for the commonwealths that she's being aimed at...

I dont understand why she's so upset. For a period of months rebecca and others have said that thier prime focus is the cwg and not europeans. She is clearly still in heavy trainin and may have a bit of a virus (she was spotted coughing heavily on the morning of the final).

She cant have it both ways. At the end of the day the swimmers she was up against were all rested, one them being the world champion and she was not too far away.

[Juicy Lucy]

Adlington gave a bbc interview before her 800m race saying her confidence had been knocked.

Regarding Rebecca Adlington, someone here said this a year ago...

... I hope so, but have doubts.

Without suit advantage after January 2010, do you think she will be able to compete at the same level?

Also, her constant mention of her 'body changing' tells a lot.
___________________

As I said, I hope I've got it wrong. I'm not getting at her, but can see cracks appearing. Maybe I'm reading it incorrectly?

I hope so, but we shall see. Next year will be interesting.
___________________

I admire the confidence other posters here have in RA. My pessimism about her swimming in the run up to 2012 seems isolated. OK, I can live with that. Time will tell.

[Gina]

Adlington's best 800m time of 2010 in the new textile suit is 8.21 which is faster than Friis who won yesterday. That time came mid season at the Barcelona leg of the Mare Nostrum tour. I reckon she was capable of better at this meet but maybe she is in a different part of her training cycle to June or she is infact ill. Who knows, but there must be so much pressure on her to win all the time from people who do not understand swimming. Good luck to her in India. If she can repeat her swim from Barcelona then she should win gold as she's ranked number 1 in the world this year.

[NotVeryFast]

I suspect the other issue with Rebecca is that the BBC hyped up her swim with the special BBC2 live coverage rather than it being hidden away on the red button. She must have been upset to not be able to live up to the hype. The BBC couldn't have known in advance how it was going to pan out, but obviously with the wonderful benefit of hindsight they would have been much better off hyping up the swims where we won gold.

[peterg]

Wasn't sure whether to contribute about the Adlington performance - but then nobody on here REALLY knows why her performance wasn't up to her usual standards, so her goes...

I agree with Gina that it may be down to a virus. Yes she will be in relatively hard training, but surely she would have been in April 2008 when she swam under 8:20 at the British champs (in a Diana suit that would be legal today IIRC) and almost broke the short course world record in Manchester. This was three months before the Olympics, so if it is felt that she wouldn't be able to taper now and again in October, then she shouldn't have been able to do it then.

[Verity]

Doesn't everyone have off days Piersol's "it is what it is" comes to mind.

V

[selkie]

On a different note, that Lars Frolander is still fast enough to compete internationally at age 36 makes me feel a little less like a geezer.

[Happi Blue]

Best wishes to Achieng in the 50 Breast this morning, she'll have got over the disappointment in the 100, learnt from it and hopefully have a great swim. Also to AJ in the fly final this afternoon, you're bound to go faster as you normally do in finals :)

[lane4]

Best wishes to Achieng in the 50 Breast this morning, she'll have got over the disappointment in the 100, learnt from it and hopefully have a great swim. Also to AJ in the fly final this afternoon, you're bound to go faster as you normally do in finals :)
Seems she's no longer called Achieng, the meet start sheets and results have her listed as Rebecca. One minute she's changing her country, then its a change of club, and now her name has been changed. What will be next?

[Happi Blue]

Officially is Rebecca Achieng Ajulu-Bushell, her friends call her Chie (pronounced Chey). Its alot simpler with Antony James - AJ ;)

[Apostle]

21.3 from bousquet without a suit in the 50 free. Wow.

Also great from simon burnett.

[Gina]

21.3 from bousquet without a suit in the 50 free. Wow.

Also great from simon burnett.

Surely that's against the modesty rule swimming naked.

Can't wait to see the final as I missed the semi final. I'm looking forward to what Cielo can do at Pan Pacs in reply to this. He's already been 21.55 this year.

[Apostle]

Surely that's against the modesty rule swimming naked.

Can't wait to see the final as I missed the semi final. I'm looking forward to what Cielo can do at Pan Pacs in reply to this. He's already been 21.55 this year.

Lol. Yes i guess that may have slowed him down if he was naked!

[selkie]

There's a "size matters" joke in there somewhere.

[saturdaynighter]

FROM THE BRITISH SWIMMING WEBSITE:

----------------------------------------------------------------------
"That was a personal best and I've not done one for so long," said Haywood “I've still got two more medals to shoot for so I'm trying not to get carried away.

"I had surgery a year ago and to come back with a best time, I'm really happy with that. It's been really hard so to come today and swim well is a relief."

Halsall (British Gas ITC Loughborough) finished her heat second fastest while team-mate Amy Smith (Loughborough University) finished eighth in the other semi.

"My swimming speed's a lot quicker than it has been," said Halsall. "I think I'm in the mix and I've got a bit left so hopefully it'll come good on Sunday. I've still got two more medals to shoot for so I'm trying not to get carried away."

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Are these Team Orders - or are we taking PR training to it's natural conclusion?

[Linny]

When are reserves nominated?

Say the fastest French guy in the 50 free injured himself getting out of the pool after the heats could the third fastest be substituted?

The rules say -Notwithstanding times and places achieved in the heats, only the two (2) fastest swimmers of each Federation may:
a) proceed to the semi-finals and/or finals;
b) take part in a swim off;
c) be nominated as a reserve.Also, if there are only two heats of an event because there are only 16 entries, are those heats automatically semi finals and subject to the limits on swimmers below?In any event where heats are not held a maximum of two (2) swimmers per Federation may take part in semi-finals, finals or timed finals.

[lidoswimmer]

Gandy is class... Fran always is.
Womens medley team looks good for Gold later and hoping Adlington soon can get rid of a few swim demons.
Great tv coverage now :-) - shame it's the last day :-(

[Apostle]

The bbc need to get rid of claire balding and get karen pickering in as the face of swimming.

[colonelhall]

I disagree about Claire Balding. I think that she is a terrific anchor woman. Not coming from a swimming background, she asks all the right questions which bring out the sort of information that the casual sports fan needs. She covers a wide range of sport for BBC and shows a sharp intelligence that is most welcome.

Lizzie Simmonds is a future star, in my opinion. Always welcome on the after-race interviews.

[colonelhall]

The commentators are congratulating themselves on spotting that final leg flyer, but wasn't it the first takeover that did for them?

[saturdaynighter]

The commentators are congratulating themselves on spotting that final leg flyer, but wasn't it the first takeover that did for them?

good spotting, Colonel Hall

i agree about Claire Balding - she is so professional, intelligent, empathetic and great with the people she's interviewing - i love her and what she does

being a good swimmer guarantees nothing about being a good presenter

John Inverdale is the male variant (probably knows a bit about everything, but that's the key)

[colonelhall]

Yup! John Inverdale for me too!

[Apostle]

Hmmm, she's a good anchor woman but she made a lot of gaffes this week. I thought eurosport had the monopoly on that. For instance francesca pellegrini was not swimming today. Neither was her sister frederica.

It just makes me think that the bbc wont invest in a presenter who has a connection with the sport.

I agree lizze has interviewed well and i also think kerry ann payne was good as well.

[Grampa]

The bbc need to get rid of claire balding and get karen pickering in as the face of swimming.

I suppose coming from Ipswich you would say that!

I thought Claire Balding was excellent,so too Kerry Ann.We need a lot more swimming coverage like this.

[colonelhall]

Kerry Anne has potential. She seems to be afraid to look at the camera, at the moment, but she can work on that.

[Apostle]

I suppose coming from Ipswich you would say that!

I thought Claire Balding was excellent,so too Kerry Ann.We need a lot more swimming coverage like this.

Lol. Not really. I mentioned karen because she has done a lot of work on the bbc both on tv and radio.

Another option might be to use sharron davies as the anchor and bring karen into the mixed zone, or someone else if you like.

Just my opinion really.

[saturdaynighter]

Lol. Not really. I mentioned karen because she has done a lot of work on the bbc both on tv and radio.

Another option might be to use sharron davies as the anchor and bring karen into the mixed zone, or someone else if you like.

Just my opinion really.

Karen P is always really professional and knowledgeable - but the engagement of the audience is what Claire B brings to the general public - I'm not sure even Sharron Davies of ''the suits round-her-thighs'' fame would be able to get non swimming fanatics to buy into the event.
Claire even accused Tom Daley of missing the Synchronised Swimming - but human frailty is what makes a geed commentator 'special' - it's too easy to be monotone and middle of the road in enthusiasm and judgement terms - we want the challenging comments, the testing of interviewees, the informed but innocent questions....

[saturdaynighter]

anybody willing/able to reflect on the women's medley relay mix of swimmers - looked to me like Fran and Amy felt the decision was a bit odd to flip Fran across to fly - had the Russians not DQ'd that might have cost GB a big medal

in athletics we have a lot of discussion about the competitors' ability to 'do their stuff' and grab a baton - in swimming we have had some interesting decisions on relays by the team managers - might be worth broadening the responsibility, in my humble, rather than having individual relay supremos

[Vincent]

Was it just me or did Simon Burnett glide for the last 1/2 metre of the 100 free. My coach would kill me if I finished 100m race like that. To make matters worse he then missed out on the final by 0.02 of a second.

He said these European champs were not the most important competition of the year. I guess the most important one for him is the one where only 2 good swimming nations are present...makes things easier doesn't it? :joker:

[Apostle]

anybody willing/able to reflect on the women's medley relay mix of swimmers - looked to me like Fran and Amy felt the decision was a bit odd to flip Fran across to fly - had the Russians not DQ'd that might have cost GB a big medal

in athletics we have a lot of discussion about the competitors' ability to 'do their stuff' and grab a baton - in swimming we have had some interesting decisions on relays by the team managers - might be worth broadening the responsibility, in my humble, rather than having individual relay supremos

At the end of the day fran was our best flyer. By switching them around would we have had a net loss. Maybe ellen gandy could have done the fly and fran the free but she'd only just done the 200.

In the end i thought it was a good selection.

[saturdaynighter]

maybe a second off Jemma's time from this morning - but a couple added to Fran's freestyle?

even if the difference was 0.5 seconds it seems a very strange decision

am sure you'll have some more accurate stats, Apostle

[colonelhall]

Not so strange:
Based on times achieved during Europeans

Fly Halsall 57.46
Free Smith 54.48

Total: 1:51.94

Fly Lowe 59.09
Free Halsall 53.58

Total: 1:52.67

Result: Excellent team selection!

[Apostle]

maybe a second off Jemma's time from this morning - but a couple added to Fran's freestyle?

even if the difference was 0.5 seconds it seems a very strange decision

am sure you'll have some more accurate stats, Apostle

I leave it to the colonel! :)

[saturdaynighter]

I leave it to the colonel! :)

mmmm - interesting use of figures/stats - by my reckoning and purely from relay swims:

Jemma Lowe swam a 58.62 in the morning - Fran did 57.46 in the fly in the final

Amy did 54.37 and earlier in the week Fran did 53.05

that looks like a very slight advantage to the Jemms/Fran combo - plus both might well have gone faster (evening swim and competitive bite chasing down the Russians!)

i agree, though, that it was closer than i'd first thought!!!

[Steve]

He said these European champs were not the most important competition of the year. I guess the most important one for him is the one where only 2 good swimming nations are present...makes things easier doesn't it? :joker:
Or maybe he's focussing on the meet that will define his funding for next year?

Besides which I don't think you can say his events will be that much easier to win in Delhi (although possibly easier to get a medal) - Eamon Sullivan, Ashley Callus and Brent Hayden are all still in the top 15 world rankings this year when they haven't yet swum an international meet. I for one would expect Sullivan to be quicker than Bernard without suits.

[colonelhall]

Hmmm! Don't want to be picky, but as you are quoting relay times, were any of those from a flying start?

[colonelhall]

The Commonwealth Games will attract far more attention than the Europeans, so it makes sense to make them the number one priority.

As far as the general public is concerned, the Commonwealth's are way ahead of the World's, in terms of interest.

[saturdaynighter]

Hmmm! Don't want to be picky, but as you are quoting relay times, were any of those from a flying start?

all of them were from a relay takeover - but that's probably the only way to compare like-with-like

either way - the swimmers seemed more baffled than i am about it - remember the 4x200 free relay in the Olympics when we failed to qualify through picking too weak a team - there have been other instances where the swimmers have been quizzed about their likely potential time!

all i was suggesting was that it might be better to have the responsibility and judgement calls shared between 2 key coaches, rather than just one (we all have our favourites, our bankers, our own calculation methods, even - so i'm guessing that the relay coaches have their frailties too)

[colonelhall]

We'll have to disagree on this one, my friend, especially as Amy Smith clocked a terrific 54.48 lead-off leg in the relay final.

[Pink Paraffin]

all i was suggesting was that it might be better to have the responsibility and judgement calls shared between 2 key coaches, rather than just one

On who's information are you suggesting that one coach made this call rather than two or more?

[Gina]

We'll have to disagree on this one, my friend, especially as Amy Smith clocked a terrific 54.48 lead-off leg in the relay final.


I would agree with you as we don't have hindsight to compare individual swims (like you did on the page before) to the final relay split above. At the end of the day we were neck and neck with the (rested) Russians and we would have beaten them outright if Effimova hadn't done such a huge flyer!


Oh and with hindsight we should have led off with Simmonds as she went sub 60 in the heats compared to Spofforths 60+ swim in the final ;););):zip::zip:

[Linny]

Just had a look at the media guide for this event because I was thinking about the commentator thing and what irritates me most about them, nearly all of them, is that they seem so ill informed and I wondered what was in it this time.

The thing that stood out for me is Dennis Pursley is 60! He looks amazing for 60.

[saturdaynighter]

Just had a look at the media guide for this event because I was thinking about the commentator thing and what irritates me most about them, nearly all of them, is that they seem so ill informed and I wondered what was in it this time.

The thing that stood out for me is Dennis Pursley is 60! He looks amazing for 60.

didn't spot Mr Pursley

i think the media gang are only (fundamentally) incoherent to the well-informed/knowledgeable amongst us (back versus breast, good times versus poor, even people's names - we'll send them to AGNEL-pronunciation school - we just gave up and called him ANGEL).

To be fair, they probably have a mass of stats and papers to juggle on a small desk area with microphones and earpieces to manage, let alone the adverts and the producers. Gosh a surge of empathy - where did that come from?

I guess, in many ways, we ought to be grateful that there was so much english language coverage of the event.

try listening to it in Hungarian!

[Gina]

I mainly watched the coverage on Eurosport and, apart for that one session where that idiot had to talk us thru the finals, I thought Mark Foster was good at commentating.

[saturdaynighter]

I mainly watched the coverage on Eurosport and, apart for that one session where that idiot had to talk us thru the finals, I thought Mark Foster was good at commentating.


That idiot was me - NO, i'm only joking!

I bet he had an old copy of Hello magazine if he's the one who got stranded when the comms went down - he even started making up people's nicknames/christian names.

Having just read Craig Lord's latest missive - does anybody know the officially pre-selected Commonwealth athletes and the remaining number of places for the English Team - I presume even some of the medal-winners from Budapest might still need to get atop the points/ratings system?

[peterg]

I mainly watched the coverage on Eurosport and, apart for that one session where that idiot had to talk us thru the finals, I thought Mark Foster was good at commentating.

Did he pronounce anyone's name correctly? While Heresemenia (sp?) might be difficult in a 50, there's no excuse for mangling Munoz or Deibler.

[Linny]

does anybody know the officially pre-selected Commonwealth athletes and the remaining number of places for the English Team - I presume even some of the medal-winners from Budapest might still need to get atop the points/ratings system?If what British Swimming, sorry, I mean the ASA, publish on their website is the official list then the selected swimmers were known in April. Qualifying at the British Trials though is hardly pre-selection!

See here (http://www.swimming.org/britishswimming/news/commonwealth-games-2010/adlington-tancock-and-spofforth-named-for-commonwealth-games/4234/).

[Apostle]

I mainly watched the coverage on Eurosport and, apart for that one session where that idiot had to talk us thru the finals, I thought Mark Foster was good at commentating.

I agree. Mark was good. Drew is always good.

What happened to James Parrack. ?

[saturdaynighter]

If what British Swimming, sorry, I mean the ASA, publish on their website is the official list then the selected swimmers were known in April. Qualifying at the British Trials though is hardly pre-selection!

See here (http://www.swimming.org/britishswimming/news/commonwealth-games-2010/adlington-tancock-and-spofforth-named-for-commonwealth-games/4234/).

thanks, Linny - i meant prior-selection/qualification

''The rest of the England swimming team will be selected following the LEN European Championships (4 - 15 August, Budapest) and the British Gas ASA National Championships (18 – 21 August, Sunderland).''

that presumably means that there are plenty of spots to be fought over on the ''against Beijing Olympics bronze medal'' position - and nobody's efforts from Budapest can be taken fro granted....

[peterg]

I agree. Mark was good. Drew is always good.

What happened to James Parrack. ?

Opinions change





http://www.swimclub.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=1836&highlight=meringue

[colonelhall]

Gina:
"At the end of the day we were neck and neck with the (rested) Russians and we would have beaten them outright if Effimova hadn't done such a huge flyer!"

I agree and that shows how important team selection can be.

"Oh and with hindsight we should have led off with Simmonds as she went sub 60 in the heats compared to Spofforths 60+ swim in the final."

Hindsight is a wonderful thing. I am sure that if Lizzie had won gold in the 100, she would have been the lead-off.

I never watch Eurosport, but I am glad that Mark Foster has done well. Perhaps he would have been a good recruit for the BBC, but who would you drop?

[Linny]

Opinions change





http://www.swimclub.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=1836&highlight=meringueChuckle. :)

I can't stand his voice, let alone the things he has to say. My favourite in Budepest went something along the lines of "Now here comes Alshammar. She's a tall swimmer, very tall, you wouldn't believe how tall a swimmer she is."

I'm at home thinking, "Sh1t, I didn't think she was that tall, how tall is she? Jeez, come on, how tall is she?" But no, he clearly didn't know. But she must be tall.


(For the record wikipedia puts her at 5'10 1/2").

PS - loved the way you searched for meringue peterg! :D

[peterg]

Chuckle. :)


PS - loved the way you searched for meringue peterg! :D

Couldn't exactly remember it. I tried souffle first:)

My favourite 'Gordonism' from Budapest was when he described the finalists of one event as reaching the nadir of their careers. He also spoke of the Germans preparing at 'Murder Camps'

[londonboy59]

We need her on the radio thanks...no mention for our Sports Extra coverage in Budapest..I'm disappointed.

Bob B

[saturdaynighter]

We need her on the radio thanks...no mention for our Sports Extra coverage in Budapest..I'm disappointed.

Bob B

hi Bob

sorry, but Budapest was ''Ballard-free''

so, from an independent (but enthusiastic) perspective, what were your reflections and how good the potential is for the Commies and Worlds next year?

was the opposition a bit mixed (in terms of quality) - or are we very near the pinnacle of where we're going to be in the pre-2012 period?

S-N

[Steve]

Can somebody (perhaps Bob?) please, please, please, please tell Andy and Adrian that there is no longer a rule which says you have to stay in the water at the end of a race (and that there hasn't been in international swimming for at least 10 years) - at least once in every televised swimming competition on the BBC we get a 2 minute conversation about how so-and-so shouldn't have gotten out at the end of the relay if other people were swimming and how they might be disqualified and what a shame that would be etc. With no one ever getting DQed for this you would think they would have worked it out! [/rant over]

One other note, I found it a tad disprespectful to be standing on the balcony interviewing people while national anthems were blaring out in the background - while I don't necessarily expect the BBC to show medal ceremonies if GB aren't involved, they could at least have shown the anthem or gone to a piece of VT. Doing similar things was one of the worst parochial aspects of sports coverage in Australia (in the 2006 Commonwealth games the TV showed Libby Lenton getting a silver in the 200 free but cut away to the studio before Caitlin got her gold for example) and I do hope we don't end up going the same way.

Otherwise I thought the BBC coverage was pretty good (except missing the start of the ladies 50m free final!)

[saturdaynighter]

http://www.swimmingresults.org/archives/swimming/results/2010/asanat10/index2.htm

http://www.swimming.org/asa/news/swimming/live-results-from-the-british-gas-asa-national-championships-50m-20101/5866/

http://www.swimming.org/library/document/team-selection-policy-england-commonwealth-games

am sure somebody will start a new posting, but the battle for the last few places at the commies looks mighty interesting

as i posted earlier in the year, it is very ironic that the opening up of the field into welsh english and scottish squads could actually work against some athletes who went to Budapest as they get squeezed by some of the stronger ones that then kick into the top slots in each event (e.g Hannah Miley going back north)

[saturdaynighter]

One other note, I found it a tad disprespectful to be standing on the balcony interviewing people while national anthems were blaring out in the background - while I don't necessarily expect the BBC to show medal ceremonies if GB aren't involved, they could at least have shown the anthem or gone to a piece of VT. Doing similar things was one of the worst parochial aspects of sports coverage in Australia (in the 2006 Commonwealth games the TV showed Libby Lenton getting a silver in the 200 free but cut away to the studio before Caitlin got her gold for example) and I do hope we don't end up going the same way.


In principle, Steve, you're absolutely right..... BUT it would be extremely tedious for the viewer not to do something constructive during the 5-7 minutes of parading and anthems

we all complain and worry about the commercial potential for swimming - the BBC have to ramp it up a bit for the benefit of the sport

i thought the chats with Claire B were ace, and pretty good for non-swimming people to at least have some engagement with ad-libbing athletes (usually the pre-recorded video clips are a bit contrived and too well controlled for my liking - and you get all the bu*lsh*t about not tapering) - we had some success - get them in front of the cameras

the alternative would be to have had a soundproof studio - then there would be the cost - then there would be the public/media outcry...

the mix from the BBC was spot on - for the non-fanatical viewer, at least

[Steve]

In principle, Steve, you're absolutely right..... BUT it would be extremely tedious for the viewer not to do something constructive during the 5-7 minutes of parading and anthems

we all complain and worry about the commercial potential for swimming - the BBC have to ramp it up a bit for the benefit of the sport

i thought the chats with Claire B were ace, and pretty good for non-swimming people to at least have some engagement with ad-libbing athletes (usually the pre-recorded video clips are a bit contrived and too well controlled for my liking - and you get all the bu*lsh*t about not tapering) - we had some success - get them in front of the cameras

the alternative would be to have had a soundproof studio - then there would be the cost - then there would be the public/media outcry...

the mix from the BBC was spot on - for the non-fanatical viewer, at least
I don't think they should show the whole ceremony parade etc, I just found Claire and Kerry-Anne or whoever almost shouting to be heard over the anthems a little unseemly. I certainly agree with you about the interviews being both interesting and good for the profile of the athletes but I'm equally sure that cutting away for 30 seconds or so of the anthem itself woudn't have hurt too much.

[Vincent]

I can't disagree with that Steve - I think La Marseillaise was being played at that time....again! : )