US Nationals

[Katie]

Looks like Georgina Lee got a British Record in the heat of the 200 fly: 2.09.40. WOW!
Day 2 results (http://www.omegatiming.com/swimming/racearchives/indianapolis2003/ussprnat_d2.htm) :D

[Pete]

Anyone know why Matthew Kidd did not swim?
Lot only was Georgina fastest qualifier but Margie was 7th fastest.

[lane4]

Alas Jo Fargus did not fair so well. A miserable 2:19 backstroke for her.

Looks like Phelps cruised a 1:58.4 back though! Is there anything he can't do?

[Katie]

I suppose it takes a long time to fully recover from an injury like Fargus's. I'm sure she'll be back. Not sure why Matt didn't swim.

[nsswimmer]

ed moses wuz ahead of world record pace in the 200m breast at 150 m, but couldnt hold it and swam a 2.11.22 which is still a VERY incredible time!!!

[Katie]

Why does he call himself Ed if it says his name's Glenn???

[Bazza]

I think Ed is his middle name, which he prefers to be known as. Might be wrong though. There used to be a middle distance runner called Ed Moses didn't there?

Anyway he is more of a sprinter and fares better in the SC pool which is probably why that last length got on top of him. 2:11 is still a very respectable time - just ask Ian Edmond.

I noticed Jo Fargus - bit of a shocker though maybe there are reasons I know not of. Pedder also had a decent 800 free on day one, but from a British perspective I guess it's all about Georgina Lee.

As I mentioned in another thread though, no Coughlin or Peirsol among others. If these are the trials, where are those swimmers and can they still get on the team at a later date?

[rogant stard]

Originally posted by bazzaroodoo
There used to be a middle distance runner called Ed Moses didn't there?

No, Ed Moses was only the best 400 metre hurdler of all time - unbeatable for a long long period.

[Steve]

I noticed Jo Fargus - bit of a shocker though maybe there are reasons I know not of.

Well she's just come back from a broken leg IIRC, only 7 or 8 months ago. Having never had a (badly or otherwise) broken limb, I couldn't say how long it would take to get back to full fitness, but seems like a pretty speedy recovery to me.

[lane4]

Originally posted by bazzaroodoo
As I mentioned in another thread though, no Coughlin or Peirsol among others. If these are the trials, where are those swimmers and can they still get on the team at a later date?

These are not the trials though! The Yanks picked their teams for this year from last year's summer nationals. Hence, not all the big names need to be there.

[Bazza]

That's pretty rubbish in my opinion.

Firstly selecting the team a year in advance is a bit of a gamble in terms of where swimmers will be in a years time. For example, last year Katy Sexton wasn't swimming world class times, but others who I can't think of right now probably were but aren't anymore?

Also I have always hated the idea of having a national championships where the elite swimmers don't show. If you beat someone who has an off day you have the right to claim the title of national champion. If they don't bother turning up because it's of no importance to them, it's just flawed.

[chlorine_babe]

I agree with bazzaroodoo and everyone else National's are meant to be the showcase of the top swimmers in the country if the top swimmers don't show up the meet is going to lose what little television coverage and advertising it gets. Although this might be different in the states and Australia. Picking a team a year in advance is just crazy too much can happen in that space of time and you can end up with an off form or understrength team.

[lane4]

Originally posted by chlorine_babe
Picking a team a year in advance is just crazy too much can happen in that space of time and you can end up with an off form or understrength team.

Does the American team for Barcelona look understrength to you!?

[croberts]

Originally posted by chlorine_babe
Picking a team a year in advance is just crazy

it only makes sense for us to have picked our 2003 World Championships Team in 2002 because we also had to pick a Pan Pac team at that time. It doesn't make an awful lot of sense to make back to back National Championships selection meets. This is especially true for our Spring Nationals because it comes on the heels of the college season. If we were picking our team this weekend, the amazing swimming with saw at men's and women's NCAAs wouldn't have happened. thats why for the most part, USA Swimming avoids making a Spring Nationals a selection meet.

[Bazza]

Well we don't have that so we can afford to put our Trials on in March/April.

Yesterday Georgina Lee got another British Record in the 100m butterfly, 1:00.24, skimming .05 off her mark from last year.

Other standout performances were Michael Phelps (51.89 100 fly compared with US record 51.88 and WR 51.81) and Ed Moses (60.21 100 breast compared with 59.94 WR and a new US record).

Also Klete Keller swam a pretty decent 400 free, 3:48.

[Bazza]

I forgot to mention before Georgina Lee did a 2:01 in the relay, again useful, and in the mens 50m freestyle - Sion Brinn. That's a familiar name. I didn't know he was still swimming. 23.69 isn't bad! Can anyone shed more light on what he's up to and why we haven't heard of him (ie he doesn't seem to come home for nationals or anything).

Just looked up the 100, he swam a 51.75.

[glen_75]

The hurdler was Edwin Moses, who won the gold medal in the 400h in Los Angeles. He was the world record holder for quite awhile.

"Ed" Moses doesn't like Glenn? :confused:

[Bazza]

Nobody said it sounded alike. :confused:

[Steve]

I thin he means that "ed" doesn't like the name glenn...;)

[croberts]

After the amazing swims in the mens 100 Fly (Phelps) and the mens 100 Breast (Moses).......look for world records to be in danger against the Australians

[Katie]

looks like the aussies themselves are in danger, not having won a single event so far... (still, only 4 have been swum)

[swimmer]

ne1 got a link to the results?

[croberts]

www.omegatiming.com

or go to

www.duelinthepool.com

[swimmer]

thanx:)

[Bazza]

Originally posted by Steve Buckley
I thin he means that "ed" doesn't like the name glenn...;)

Oops! :o

For some reason I read that as "Ed" Moses doesn't *sound* like "Glenn"! Sorry Glen!! :o

[chlorine_babe]

The duel was a big disappointment with alot of the bigger Aussie names missing and some of the American swimmers not swimming as well as previous form indicated they would. I doubt it's a format that will continue due to lack of enthusism form the better swimmers.

[croberts]

Well, its a meet format that has great potential. The unfortunate thing is that many of the best Australians got scared and stayed home. Given that they were competing against almost a "B" team from Australia, they preformed quite well. Its hard to push yourself to records if competition doesn't exist. (example: its hard for Natalie Coughlin to go faster than 59.58 if Australian girls are going 1:03)........

[swimmer]

who won overall in the end?

[Rachel]

Originally posted by croberts
Its hard to push yourself to records if competition doesn't exist. (example: its hard for Natalie Coughlin to go faster than 59.58 if Australian girls are going 1:03)........

Grant Hackett doesn't have any trouble pushing himself without any real competition to speak of...!

USA won 196-74

[glen_75]

Actually Klete pushed grant to a 1:46.64 in the 200 free when he was hoping to conserve for the 1500. Klete swam 1:47.08. Not bad.

Hackett went 14:48 in the 1500 which is pedestrian for him.
17 year old Larsen Jensen was left in his wake at 15:00. You're right, not much competition but more than he got at nationals!

David Davies and Jensen could be battling it out for the minor medals in Barcelona. Hopefully Davies will rise to be a gold medal contender in Beijing. Graeme Smith will looking the step on the rostrum. Really, Britain and the US have the best middle-long swimmers after Australia. Only Italy is also in that mix.

It used to be the Germans and the former communist bloc nations battling it out. Remember the era of Salnikov, Jorg Hoffman, Wojdat, etc.? That was before Kieren came along.
Igor Cherniskiy is good but inconsistent.

Canadians always disappoint me. Always knocking on the door but never walk through it. I thought Rick Say and Mark Johnston were going to take Canada to the next level.

[Bazza]

What about Yuri Prilukov, a young Russian who I think won the European Shortcourse last December? Actually he might have won the Longcourse as well. I don't remember because we weren't there.

Also in the womens, China and Japan can boast Hua Chen and Sachiko Yamada the 800 world record holder shortcourse, and there is the European contingent with the likes of Eva Risztov, Flavia Rigamonti, Jana Henke and Hannah Stockbauer.

[glen_75]

Prilukov has shown potential. But Davies and Jensen are about a year ahead in their progress. You're spot on....I did overlook him.

I was primarily talking about the men. The continental contingent is stronger in the women's middle-long. Now that Bennett is recovering from two surgeries (I personally don't think she'll ever swim sub 8:20 for 800 again) Rigamonti is the best distance swimmer in the world. Risztov is emerging as the next talent and may surpass everyone in Barcelona. I am less convinced by the other names you mentioned. Stockbauer is erratic. So is Yamada, who though still young has been around awhile. When she was younger she was hyped as the next Janet Evans.
She's solid but not a potential gold medalist. She did not win at Pan pacs. Henke's Berlin performance was odd given her age and previous personal best. So I'm skeptical she can repeat that.
The Chinese always seem to do their best times in China. When is the last time they performed at a major long course meet?

Right now I would pick Risztov in the 400 and Rigamonti in the 800 for Barcelona. I think Cooke has a good chance at the podium especially if she can repeat her Manchester form.

Hopefully, by next year Brittany Reimer will be able to crack a desperately needed breakthrough performance.

[croberts]

Yes, the Chinese never seem to perform well outside of China (well at least since the 1994 World Championships). Funny how that works.

[Bazza]

I think they do alright come crunch time.

You have a point but at the Olympics or maybe Worlds LC they usually turn up.

If your (conspiracy?) theory is corrct, the Beijing Games will be *very* interesting indeed!

[GettingFaster]

Might be something to do with the food. I was lucky enough to go to Beijing with work recently, and the food is completely foreign to a Western palate. Very tasty once you got past "fish head stew" (quick, where's the bucket) but there's lots of noodles and rice for the cautious. I have also met a Chinese visitor to Europe who had really big problems dealing with our scoff. Potatoes and bread are not really staples over there.

[glen_75]

Bazza--

It's not much less of a conspiracy than East Germany in the 70's and 80's. I don't know about China's swimming program presently, but It seems likely that their sudden ascendancy from 92-94 was drug assisted. Also, look at Ma's Army from the same period when Chinese women middle and distance runners were unbeatable on the track. Now they aren't even on the radar. You know about Ma...he attributed their success to catepillars and fungus.

I don't know about today, but suspicions aside....they have been inconsistent...that is indisputable. Qu Hui has probably been their most consistent performer in breaststroke and one of the few who swim outside of China very often. Yet, even she has erratic performances. They were solid but not dominant in short course events in Moscow. They did not overwhelm at Worlds in 2001 and they pulled out of Pan-Pacs last year. There's nothing indicating they dope. I am pointing out their inconsistency. They aren't the only inconsistent country. Sometimes teams disappoint, look at the discrepancy between the trials and Sydney Olympics for the Japanese and German swimmers. No one knows what to expect.

I would expect a robust home effort in Beijing...that seems to be the case for most hosts. I am pretty confident we won't see repeats of 92-94.

[croberts]

If you want to read really good theories (however i'm not neccessarily agreeing with them), search the archives at swiminfo.com. its editor feels very strongly on the issue and seems to back up his arguments very well. i'm not a conspiracy theorist (on China or JFKs asassination), but I do think that perhaps everything isn't 100% all right in China

[Bazza]

Hey that was a bit of a lighthearted statement.

I'm not old enough to recall 92-94 but I do remember names like Jingyi Le and Yanyan Wu swimming suspiciously fast times.

Interesting when I visited the FINA World Records page, there are three unratified world records. Two of them are fairly recent (Benko 400 free, Rupprath 100 IM), and one is over two years old (Hui QI 200 breast)!