2001 800 Free Relay

[croberts]

I know this opens up old wounds, but I was reminded of this when the issue of hte Libby Lenton DQ at the Duel in the Pool was brought up. The CAS and FINA decided to award duplicate gold medals and declare co-world champions for the Women's 800 Free Relay in Fukuoka. However, the Fina website fails to make any mention of this fact in the results or in the press releases that talk about the event. The time was also a meet record so I wonder if the program for Barcelona 03 will reflect as such. I wish there was an easy way to contact someone at FINA to have them fix this. It just seems unfair

[Bazza]

Yes this was quite a sham.

Possibly biased (ME?!) but I feel GBR were the rightful winners of that event.

Still it remains possibly the most controversial result in World Champs history, with the decision making process dragging on for quite some time!

[swimmer]

Quote bazzaroodoo "I feel GBR were the rightful winners of that event"

i would have to aggree with that one too :d

[Katie]

I'm pretty confused about how, if they decided Libby Lenton's time could stand, and she therefore didn't do anything to get DQd, she didn't get reinstated?

[chlorine_babe]

The video evidence couldn't be used to go against the referee's decision and reinstate her as the winner but apparently they will still let the time stand I don't get that either.

[croberts]

Originally posted by bazzaroodoo
I feel GBR were the rightful winners of that event.

Christina Teuscher didn't false start, it was faulty Seiko timing equipment. It was problematic all throughout the week. The US were the rightful champions. Australia can't whine about that event, their DQ was flagrant. :D

[Steve]

<i>Bill Sweetenham on <A href="http://www.pullbuoy.co.uk/billsweetenham.html" target="_blank">pullbuoy</a></i>
<b>Going back to the world championships last year, the women's 4x200 relay was quite controversial at the time, but what do you make of FINA's subsequent decision to award the US gold medals? </b>

You have to understand that the US have a lot of political clout with FINA. My stand on the situation has always been that Britain did it 100% right. I've never said that US should be disqualified or that Australia should be disqualified. What I've said is that we did it according to the rules, and the judiciary appeal committee made decisions on the evidence they had before them. On that day they chose to award the gold medal to Great Britain. I have no problem with that decision. So if they make decisions after that I have no commitment to them. But certainly our girls did one hell of a job and swam way beyond themselves.

Says it all if you ask me...:)

[Bazza]

I can see this kicking off again, especially now we have a few members stateside, but I'll stir things up anyway:

I don't buy the faulty timing equipment bit. I never heard of it being faulty "all week" before this happened, and I don't recall any other problems arising as a result of it. You are at the World Championships, and if the problems were that bad you would have thought (maybe wrongly!) that the Worlds Governing Body could sort something out (ie an alternative).

But they didn't, which says to me they are standing by the timing equipment and the readouts it gives, therefore if it says she did a flier she did a flier.

[chris_lamb]

It does seem unlikely that the equipment would be left faulty for a major competition. They would more than likely have had a complete spare set of equipment in case anything broke. It is of course possible that the equipment failed to operate correctly on that instance.

[croberts]

From Swiminfo.com
The US hopes to base its case on the fact that a German protest was lodged, and subsequently withdrawn Friday, after the timing sysetm had recorded a 0.97sec early break by an Australian in the men's 4x200m.....

The use of the video footage in the German v Australia case also served to highlight one thing: what the timing system in the Marine Messe pool could not prove, broadcast images could. The inevitable conclusion is that there a problem with the Seiko timing in Fukuoka, and it is one that potentially casts doubts on every result at the world championships, including the three world records set by Ian Thorpe.

Just wanted to add my share of the quotes.... FINA did actually recognize problems with the timing system when it told reporters that often the touchpads did not stop because they required a greater amount of pressure on the finish. The technical director of FINA admitted to that being a problem during the championship and acknowledged that it very well may have been the case in the Womens 4x200. Anyways, I digress, I was really just hoping with my original post that someone knew how to get in touch with someone at FINA because really there are joint champions from 2001 and I believe the web site should be accurate especially for the World's Governing Body.

[Steve]

If it bothers you that much, you could try e-mailing any of the people listed here:

http://www.fina.org/bureau.html

or in one of the other categories here:

http://www.fina.org/hand.html

I wouldn't hold your breath though, not only is the FINA site out of date in many areas, this is hardly a great sequence of events for them and I don't think they really want to publicise it too much!

[glen_75]

I don't think the results should ever be altered after the meet is over. However, it was not the case that the Seiko timing was unflawed. In fact it was terrible. When Anthony Ervin won the 100 free the timing system did not register a time. It was evident in real time that Ervin had touched out VdH. They had to look at footage of the race to confirm it. They just added a tenth of a second advantage over Vdh based on what they reviewed.

Then, the Australian 4x200 free relay was given a bogus changeover readout, when it was clear that it was a conservative transition that was clearly not a violation. The videotape was examined for this case. This is why you will not be seeing Seiko at Worlds or most major meets in the future. Fina was nonplussed.

Nevertheless it is bad practice to change results or award medals after a meet is over. If they want to amend something it should be done before the meet is concluded and the competitors go home as in the case of Salt Lake City.

Whatever your allegiances, you have to admit that the Australians were the fastest to the wall. The infraction is like victory courtesy of a competitor signing an incorrect scorecard in golf. A rule is a rule but it is not the same satisfaction.

In any event, I would think from a British point of view the commonwealth victory over Australia would be sweeter. Most of you should appreciate that you are fortunate. Canadians don't have much of an opportunity for relay medals.

[swimmer]

QUOTE Glen_75: "When Anthony Ervin won the 100 free the timing system did not register a time. It was evident in real time that Ervin had touched out VdH. They had to look at footage of the race to confirm it. They just added a tenth of a second advantage over Vdh based on what they reviewed."


don't they use back up timing?? and people with stopwatches just incase?? just incase this exact situation should arise? (we see them using back-up times allllllllllllll the time at C.P!)

[Bazza]

I thought we had, in another thread, decided using video evidence wasn't within the guidelines....

Obviously this is an exceptional circumstance, but again while you get problems at local meets, it's pretty unacceptable to have them at the World Championships.

I'm not surprised FINA have dumped Seiko, but am surprised they even used them in the first place. I would have thought they would make some kind of agreement with a company like Omega to do the timing for x years....

[glen_75]

The primary point of my post was that there were some embarassing mishaps with Seiko at Worlds which Seiko would not come clean on until after the meet.

There was no back up timing system for the touchpads. Also, the allowance of a tenth of a second seems arbitrary. On the replay, it looked as though it may have been closer to a quarter of a second at least. 48.33 remains the official American record, which is really a concession to Ervin for the ineptness of Seiko. Biondi should not complain though because if anything, the time awarded may have been slower. Other athletes who didn't medal did not register times either. Seiko claimed this was the fault of the athletes for not touching the wall hard enough?? :confused: Ervin clearly came in to the wall briskly enough. I have never had a problem with this and neither has my daughter at local meets.

They should exclude video evidence as long as they are consistent. If you allow it in some instances they should permit in other cases.

[croberts]

I agree, its just really a matter of consistency. FINA seems to contradict itself an awful lot. And neither FINA nor Seiko would admit to the problem at the meet. Swimmers shouldn't have to adjust to the touchpads, the pads should really be able to detect any touch stronger than normal water splashing against it.