Great Swimming in Inverness!

[lane4]

Signs that Scottish swimming is definitely moving forward at a strong pace were evident in Inverness last weekend. Well over 100 Scottish records have been broken in they year 2000 with over 20 at this meet. There were fantastic swims from Alasdair Hall (50.7 free, 57.0 back, 2:04 IM, 25.1 fly at age 16) , Louise Coull (61.4 and 2:10 backstrokes at age 16), Rachel Keir (64 back at age 14), Paul Stevenson (1:51 200 free), Iain MacMillan (54.4 and 1:57.8 free at age 14), Lewis Smith (1:15 and 2:39 breast, 18:12 1500 free, 2:26 and 5:07 IM, 1:06 and 2:27 fly at age 12), Charles Mills (2:15 fly at age 13).
Such swims show their is real strength here now and was also pleasing to see the depth growing too. And even better was that the good swims/swimmers are not just coming from centres of excellence or funded large city or regional squads but also from numerous local clubs such as Warrender, Dunbarton, FAST, Duns, Elgin etc.
There is obviously still a very large hill to climb before Scotland can seriously challenge the major players across the board on the Commonwealth Games stage but the prospects for the future are looking particularly good, and that is despite the ever growing influx of English swimmers taking advantage of the ridiculous live here for 6 months and you can swim for us.

[outsidesmoker]

couldn't agree more - excellent to see you scots swimming so well - although i thought that Warrender Baths were part of the City of Edinburgh set up under the guidance of Tim Jones. I see that one of his protege's that you forgot to mention was Kirsty Balfour who broke the Scottish Records in the 50 (32.57) and 100 breast (69.97). We will look forward to seeing messers Smith and co. making simillar progress in the future. Meanwhile i would be interested to hear what everybody's thoughts are on coach education for those that are obviously producing the goods at the age group level. Should these swimmers be "moved on" (i presume thats the way to go if the club is part of an agreed system) or should the coach be encouraged and educated to take these guys further? With the talent so widespread in Scotland it will be interesting to find out which way this goes and whether the "institute" will play it's targeted role of helping talented swimmers.

[lane4]

It was also promising to see some young Sussex swimmers making an impact at the Inverness meet albeit just a small number of them. Watch out for 2 or 3 clubs to make significant progress in the Sussex area over the coming months. Missing Balfour off the list of top notch performances was an untimely error, although probably caused by not noticing her around as much these days as it appears competitions are now less frequent for her. After her quality swims in Inverness it must only be a matter of time now before she converts her fantastic long course times under her previous coach into short course equivalents.
For coach education, it is the policy of the British NPD that the coach's experience must always stay ahead of the swimmer. Thus, with the rapid progress of Scottish swimmers, watch for an increase in education for the coaches of these talented swimmers led by ASFGB and SASA. The authorities are becoming increasingly aware that the goods can be produced in places other than funded centres and big city or composite squads. This will clearly be good for the coaches of these swimmers and therefore lead to more progress. The Scottish Institute is only likely to help the 'chosen' few and not necessarily the wider range of talented promising club swimmers. One must hope that, for the benefit of Scottish swimming's future, a policy of deveoping more coaches and more clubs is adopted rather than trying to move any good swimmer that comes along into a current centre or big funded programme.
As Bill Sweetenham said at the Turning the Tide conference in Glasgow recently, the majority of medal winners in Sydney came from a club (not centre/institute) background and had had 4 or less coaches total in their competitive career.

[DAK]

Signs that Scottish swimming is definitely moving forward at a strong pace were evident in Inverness last weekend. Well over 100 Scottish records have been broken in they year 2000 with over 20 at this meet. There were fantastic swims from Alasdair Hall (50.7 free, 57.0 back, 2:04 IM, 25.1 fly at age 16) , Louise Coull (61.4 and 2:10 backstrokes at age 16), Rachel Keir (64 back at age 14), Paul Stevenson (1:51 200 free), Iain MacMillan (54.4 and 1:57.8 free at age 14), Lewis Smith (1:15 and 2:39 breast, 18:12 1500 free, 2:26 and 5:07 IM, 1:06 and 2:27 fly at age 12), Charles Mills (2:15 fly at age 13).
Such swims show their is real strength here now and was also pleasing to see the depth growing too. And even better was that the good swims/swimmers are not just coming from centres of excellence or funded large city or regional squads but also from numerous local clubs such as Warrender, Dunbarton, FAST, Duns, Elgin etc.
There is obviously still a very large hill to climb before Scotland can seriously challenge the major players across the board on the Commonwealth Games stage but the prospects for the future are looking particularly good, and that is despite the ever growing influx of English swimmers taking advantage of the ridiculous live here for 6 months and you can swim for us.

A very old thread but what happened to all the promising swimmers at these Scottish Championships. Did they all drop out before fufilling their potential? As far as I can see only Lewis Smith is still going and has just made the Euro Senior team.

Maybe Mr4 or Rocky can shed some light on why this talent disapeared?

[rogant stard]

As far as I can see only Lewis Smith is still going and has just made the Euro Senior team.

Iain Macmillan still around - just missed out on the CG's team for 200 Fly in August and still plying his trade.

[Martin-Y]

As Bill Sweetenham said at the Turning the Tide conference in Glasgow recently, the majority of medal winners in Sydney came from a club (not centre/institute) background and had had 4 or less coaches total in their competitive career.
Is this still the case? With Ben Titley training a group of girls and Ian Turner the boys at Loughborough are we not trying to emulate the success of cycling that has all the guys living and training in one place.
Also you may get quality by centralisation but the only way to get depth is by coaching the coaches and spreading the knowledge base around the country.

[lane4]

A very old thread but what happened to all the promising swimmers at these Scottish Championships. Did they all drop out before fufilling their potential? As far as I can see only Lewis Smith is still going and has just made the Euro Senior team.

Maybe Mr4 or Rocky can shed some light on why this talent disapeared?
Louise Coull did make it to the Commonwealth Games. The others all retired too early, no doubt for various different reasons, before they had reached their potential. A real shame that they could not have been persuaded to keep going.

[DAK]

A real shame that they could not have been persuaded to keep going.

It is a real shame, I remember being amazed by some of A.Hall's times around that period although I am not sure if he ever produced quite the same performances LC.

Do you think these swimmers would have been more likely to have been persuaded to carry on in the current set-up in Scottish Swimming?

[rogant stard]

It is a real shame, I remember being amazed by some of A.Hall's times around that period although I am not sure if he ever produced quite the same performances LC.

Do you think these swimmers would have been more likely to have been persuaded to carry on in the current set-up in Scottish Swimming?

In what way do you think the "current set-up in Scottish Swimming" differs to how it was back then?

[DAK]

In what way do you think the "current set-up in Scottish Swimming" differs to how it was back then?

I was thinking of the Institute of Sport set-up which I believe was in it's infancy (or didn't yet exist) in those days. Maybe it doesn't differ hence the question.

[Taxiandbank]

Is this still the case? With Ben Titley training a group of girls and Ian Turner the boys at Loughborough are we not trying to emulate the success of cycling that has all the guys living and training in one place.
Also you may get quality by centralisation but the only way to get depth is by coaching the coaches and spreading the knowledge base around the country.
I'm sure James Gibson would appreciate that generalisation

I think the "institute of sport" model was mooted some years ago and shouted down. So we now have areas of expertise(?). Sprinters at Swansea and Hull. Breaststrokers (from recent results) appearing to be at Bath or Coventry. Backstrokers at offshore centre (or Lincoln).
I haven't looked at the breakdown of Scotish results but it seemed that they were spread around Aberdeen, South Aberdeen, Glasgow, Stirling, Gairioch.

[NotVeryFast]

Centres of excellence seem an excellent idea to me if you'll forgive the pun!

In the Horizon programme on TV about winning gold in 2012, they showed some of the high tech facilities, I can't remember what was where, but I think it was the Australian facilities that looked the most impressive. They had tremendous capabilities to look at what was going on under the water and optimise every single bit of the swimmer's race, e.g. they had some vertical poles in the pool that the swimmer passed between. I think these gave them the times from diving in to reach specific distances underwater, so they could try to gain 0.1 secs here, 0.1 secs there, etc.

Then at the cycling place in Manchester, they were talking about how they try to achieve a 1% improvement in 25 different aspects of cycling performance, so again, it's attention to detail, trying to gain every tiny advantage in every way you can.

I don't doubt that a club without such modern facilities can get a very long way towards the top, but surely a centre of excellence with the very best facilities is always going to be able to take things that tiny bit further and get that final tiny bit of extra performance out of a swimmer that might make the difference between gold and 4th place at the Olympics.

[rogant stard]

I haven't looked at the breakdown of Scotish results but it seemed that they were spread around Aberdeen, South Aberdeen, Glasgow, Stirling, Gairioch.

...and maybe Edinburgh

[Taxiandbank]

...and maybe Edinburgh
Sorry, and Edinburgh (missed it as a Breaststroke C.o.E as well)

[ruthcp]

Taxiandbank don't you ever sleep?!!! :eek:
You often post at amazing hours of the night/morning, or are you abroad?

[Taxiandbank]

No just up at 4.00 am for training and checking posts!

[Graham Wardell]

Louise Coull did make it to the Commonwealth Games. The others all retired too early, no doubt for various different reasons, before they had reached their potential. A real shame that they could not have been persuaded to keep going.


Coull on the comeback trail.........she's an RMP in the army and just went 68.2 and 2.28 (LC) at Army champs. And all off only 2 weeks training!!!!!!!!