Phelps VS Spitz

[2.tso]

Ok, here is another one for you all,

same training.
same year.
same place
same coach
same equipment

who is the better?????

vote 1 in 1972 and 1 in 2008

Phelps 1972
Spitz 1972
phelps 2008
spitz 2008

[rabbitrabbit]

Eh??????

[rabbitrabbit]

Must be me, I don't understand?????????? pleeese explain!!!!!!!
Ps I know who you are!!

[2.tso]

its simple, who would be a better swimmer in 1972? who would be a better swimmer in 2008?
given that they would have same coach etc etc its simple just pick!

[rabbitrabbit]

I haven't taken my meds today!

[2.tso]

Ps I know who you are!!


oh fame at last!

[rabbitrabbit]

How come youv'e retired from coaching?

[zanshin]

Ps I know who you are!!

Scary:zip:

[Stevie_k]

Are we voting for who would win in a Sumo suit match?

[2.tso]

no you are voting who would be the better swimmer in 1972 and in 2008 with the same training etc!!! ohhhhh stevie k you do my tree in think rocky 6!!!!!!

[Spidey]

Are we also voting for who has the best chance given what they know, going back in time, or going foward in time?

[Stevie_k]

I have not got a scooby doo.

Ive never even seen spitz swim.

[Spidey]

I have not got a scooby doo.

Ive never even seen spitz swim.!!!! Stevie, I am aghast. 7 golds from 7 events. Someone must have a youtube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ek0xTjMpIZ4&feature=related) link for you.

[Stevie_k]

!!!! Stevie, I am aghast. 7 golds from 7 events. Someone must have a youtube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ek0xTjMpIZ4&feature=related) link for you.

so what are his pb's?

[Spidey]

so what are his pb's?I don't know. NVF is your man for the stats.

[Linny]

Bit of a silly poll really, although I couldn't stop myself from voting! :D

Phelps is clearly better but noone will ever know whether Spitz could have acheived more had he been born to a different era (although i've assumed not on the basis of probability), nor what impact being born earlier would have had on Phelps himself, I mean he might have never learnt to swim cos we were all dead poor back then.

[lane4]

Bit of a silly poll really, although I couldn't stop myself from voting! Indeed, it's probably the worst poll ever but still you cast your vote. And even though I did too, I still can't make sense of what the results are supposed to tell us. It's really a pointless question.

[Stevie_k]

On the link spidey put up spitz came in at 1:54.

Was that the last leg of a 200 im or is that over 10 seconds behind phelps 200 free WR.

Whats so different. They have the same food choices.

So long as they are both clean, it seems clear that spits is average and the rest of the swimmers back then were useless.

[Linny]

On the link spidey put up spitz came in at 1:54.

Was that the last leg of a 200 im or is that over 10 seconds behind phelps 200 free WR.

Whats so different. They have the same food choices.

So long as they are both clean, it seems clear that spits is average and the rest of the swimmers back then were useless.Stevie, you really are a card!

Have a read of this (http://www.swimclub.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=2669) thread (take a pinch of salt on occasion), but in there you will see some of the reasons why what you have just said is complete twaddle.

Consider rule changes, pool design, lane rope technology, body suits (and even though speedos are much nicer, body suits do make swimmers faster), supplements, training advances, moustaches (;)) and no doubt a whole host of other things.

[FlyingBean]

Whatever happened to Geochuck he hasn't been active since last July. Anyone know if he's OK.

Anyway, back to the thread....

[Apostle]

I think phelps wins because he has does IM's as well.

[Juicy Lucy]

Whatever happened to Geochuck he hasn't been active since last July. Anyone know if he's OK.



He's fine. I was in touch with him last week. He said he'll be keeping an eye on the forum.

[Stevie_k]

it is a daft poll, you have too much time on your hands mate, you should be doing something useful like surfing for boobies.

I have voted for Phelps 2008 though because i am at work and bored and have nothing better to do (unfortunately cannot surf boobies here).

Phelps is the daddy of the mac whatever way you look at it.

Spitz was crap and his competitors were crapper.

[catena]

Never Stevie, you've just gone for fastskins over budgies!!!

[Stevie_k]

Never Stevie, you've just gone for fastskins over budgies!!!

NICE SHOT, i have to respect that, i am reeling a little bit i admit.

Still, i think 10 seconds is a lot to ask of a fastskin.

[Apostle]

it is a daft poll, you have too much time on your hands mate, you should be doing something useful like surfing for boobies.

I have voted for Phelps 2008 though because i am at work and bored and have nothing better to do (unfortunately cannot surf boobies here).

Phelps is the daddy of the mac whatever way you look at it.

Spitz was crap and his competitors were crapper.

Spitz was CRAP!!!!!! Stevie you've been looking at too many boobies. The guy was the phelps of his day and brilliant.

[Stevie_k]

Stevie you've been looking at too many boobies.

Not possible!

1:54 aint all that and packet of potato chips!

[animal0800]

er - I don't really know Phelps sorry, not really up with world swimming - Who is he ? - has he won as many medals as Spitz ?

[Apostle]

Not possible!

1:54 aint all that and packet of potato chips!

would you class sonny liston in the same fitness levels as a modern day heavy? Sports science moves on in every sport.

[RaoulD]

Spitz won all his golds in world record time and his times were not beaten for several years after that. He held the 100m fly world record for 10 years. Phelps is now slightly older than Spitz was when he retired. I suspect that if they were around at the same time and had the same coaching Spitz would win the 100m events while Phelps would win over the longer distances.

[Pandi]

er - I don't really know Phelps sorry, not really up with world swimming - Who is he ? - has he won as many medals as Spitz ?

Has Phelps managed to shift as many "stars & stripes" speedo cossies worldwide?Must be amongst one of the most iconic symbols of the 70's in that design.IMHO

[Juicy Lucy]

Has Phelps managed to shift as many "stars & stripes" speedo cossies worldwide? Must be amongst one of the most iconic symbols of the 70's in that design.IMHO

Here he is...

[Apostle]

Here he is...

I have to confess that I had a pair when I was younger.

But I didn't look as good as Stevie.

[Stevie_k]

I have to confess that I had a pair when I was younger.

But I didn't look as good as Stevie.

Thats Mark Spitz not me :aarrgghh:

hehe you are right though, i do look fabulous in budgies.

[Apostle]

Thats Mark Spitz not me :aarrgghh:

hehe you are right though, i do look fabulous in budgies.

Steve. Mate. I KNOW that was not you!

[Stevie_k]

Steve. Mate. I KNOW that was not you!


Are you saying he looks better than me in budgies ??? :mad:

[Apostle]

I'm going to take the 5th on that one.

[Thespud111]

Quality tash on that man!

[Spidey]

Thats Mark Spitz not me :aarrgghh:

hehe you are right though, i do look fabulous in budgies.

I can hear Carly Smon singing in the background.

[Fajja]

I'd say phelps 08 for sure, what he achieved was just stunning, if spitz and phelps were the same age, had same training and equipment, phelps would win just from his physique!!

[Apostle]

I believe his time in the 200 freestyle which was a world record at the time was 1:54.

how times have moved on!!

I still think Phelps because of the IM's.

I even think that if he decides to change events in 2012 look out for new times being set in the 100/200 back and 400 free. I bet if wanted to he could take on the breastrokers!

[RaoulD]

Spitz's last WR was 1.52.78. It lasted about 2 years. Given that it was swum without googles and a LZR suit (or even a lycra one) and in a pool which was relatively shallow compared to Beijing, it is still pretty good now.

Compare the 400m free records over the same period. In 1972 the record was about 4 minutes but is now 3.40 (and has been since 2002).

I think the problem with comparing Phelps and Spitz is that although both are exceptional butterfly swimmers, Spitz was primarily a 100m sprinter whereas Phelps is better over the longer distances (where his high lactate tolerance provides more of an advantage). Spitz did not also have a 50m event which he would probably have won as well.

[Stevie_k]

OK how about this. Seb co was running 800 meters in a low 1:42 the late 1970's. Barely a second has been shaved off that in nearly 30 years.

And check this. GOLD James Hines, USA 9.95 in 1968.

It took about 20 years to better it.

Same story in the 200.

1968 GOLD Tommie Smith, USA 19.83

Swimming records are dropping like the clackers by comparison.

Its obvious why. Bloody technology. We dont need it. Swimming should be pure, just like running!!!

ARE YOU READING SPEEDO!

[doublexpresso]

Swimming should be pure, just like running!!!



Mmm - do you mean the sort of running where they wear expensively designed spikes - sometimes subtly different to suit each foot -fancy lycra suits - sometimes with go faster sleeves!! Ok so Bolt doesn't need that fancy stuff but the others do.

[Stevie_k]

Mmm - do you mean the sort of running where they wear expensively designed spikes - sometimes subtly different to suit each foot -fancy lycra suits - sometimes with go faster sleeves!! Ok so Bolt doesn't need that fancy stuff but the others do.

lol didnt you read my last post?

If they are making stuff its isnt doing much good is it. Running world records are RARE and have been since the late 60's.

[Improving a lot]

Perhaps because humans are designed to run - it is natural. So it is harder to increase the speed at which we run without selective breeding to aid evolution. Swimming is not natural to humans, so we were not equipped to be able to do it. Therefore we are still developing the most efficient/powerful techniques and furthering our knowledge of dynamics in water - a different medium to that which we are used to. Because we are still having these advancements, time drops are far more regular and pronounced.

[Tewson Veste]

Front crawl is a difficult one as no rules have changed much. Starts have changed, swimming under water for longer has changed, Lane ropes have changed, depth of pools have changed. Finally swimwear has changed.

In Back and Breast strokes the rules have changed big time whch has contributed big time to lower records.

As an old swimming buddy from the 70's says. We would be lucky to qualify for nationals these days (With our past times) let alone make finals!!

[cougar]

Perhaps because humans are designed to run - it is natural. So it is harder to increase the speed at which we run without selective breeding to aid evolution. Swimming is not natural to humans, so we were not equipped to be able to do it. Therefore we are still developing the most efficient/powerful techniques and furthering our knowledge of dynamics in water - a different medium to that which we are used to. Because we are still having these advancements, time drops are far more regular and pronounced.

Hey up ode pal doh yow no we wuz once in a aquatic world, we still have a dive reflex ( honest guv ) ar shud no i used to practise olding me breath un all that mullarky. Ar think its just another time forgotten skill..

[FinFan]

Trying to compare swimmers, runners, footballers etc from two totally different generations is pretty impossible. I've got no doubt that in 20 years the records set by Phelps will have all been broken, probably several different times. Just like Bolt beating Michael Johnson's records - at the time Johnson was the king, now it's Bolt. Fingers crossed the next star will be a Brit! (insert laughter here)