Creating a Club Website - Advice sought!

Techno-phobe · 31-05-2010, 09:22 PM

We are looking to create a website for a medium sized club, and would welcome advice. In particular we are interested in recommendations of people or firms who might do the work, or in seeing specifications that you may have put together to commission similar projects. We would also be interested in particular tips or advice on what to do or not to do.

One thought gleaned from an earlier thread, is there may also be an opportunity to consider linking the need for web-hosting, with a solution to the need for authorised users to be able to access internal data, perhaps through having some club data hosted externally, but in a secure way. This would get us away from the constraints that come with storing data on a single PC, but presumably there are different pitfalls. We would welcome other people's thoughts and experience.

In addition does anyone have experience of using a PayPal type facility for internal club payments such as competition fees and Club Shop. It is being offered as an add on by a firm we have spoken to.

Many thanks, and please PM if you would prefer.

haltonwebmaster · 11-09-2010, 03:04 PM

The haltonsc website has been running using Joomla, now version 1.5, for around 8 years. (Joomla.org) Joomla is one of many Content Management social networking alternatives. All of the added haltonsc site functions, language translation, Google map addons, online training diary Endurance Log, User forum , random pictures, template, photo gallery are open source and were costless.
Though there are many free joomla adaptable templates available, a template of your own can be designed and created very easily using Artisteer 2 (This costs ~£45 for the student version of the package). You can download this template designer and play with it, though when online it's not as efficient as a hand coded template design.
Other Content Management main alternatives are Drupal, Wordpress , PHBB and a few others and I’m not sure how good these are. I believe that Drupal has more categories than Joomla and is more SEO (search engine) friendly.
With time and expertise a site can be written in pure PHP/MYSQL/CSS, but this is a bit of a task for a novice, see book PHP and MYSQL for Dummies.
Joomla has a system similar to Swimclub's that requires an email response address , though open registration can be switched off and controlled individually by the administrator. Joomla has a super administrator who can allocate admin levels, managers and registered users so that different views are available to members and a number of individuals can share the responsibility of adding articles, pictures or new functions. Joomfish is an additional function that allows pages to be portrayed in multiple languages by the click of a flag. Joomla! is a dynamic Web application because it uses a database (MySQL) to store all of the content and uses a programming language (PHP) to power its functionality. Minimal technical knowledge is needed, apart from when dealing with installation, customising or security.
Recently I have been setting up another standard site at justshost.com which has online any time tech help which is significantly better than the haltonsc current host.
A standard website often shares user space with other host members and it is not secure enough for Paypal .
Joomla has a lowcost Paypal function but can only be used safely using the provisos below. A standard website often shares user space with other host members and it is not secure enough for Paypal . To use Paypal, 2 must additions are needed, a dedicated IP address and SSL (secure server , these sites are always prefixed with an address that reads https: rather than http: ) SSL and a dedicated IP options are always significantly more expensive and probably not for a small club. Error see later note

At justhost, the domain name is free for life and currently a 5 years site hosting costs £117. A parked domain costs another £9 per added name per annum. (A Parked domain is when you type) www.anyname.co.uk or www.anyname.com and they all go to the same webpage. One is the real web address, the other a parked web address.
Many of the hosts offering unlimited this and that are often Linux based but files can be up/downloaded or accessed using open source ftp programs (e.g. firefox, fireftp) Joomla can be freely downloaded and run and functions tested on a MS Windows platform ie Laptop using a Apache servers XAMPP (free) or WAMPSERVER (free). Harvard University, Macdonalds, Burger King, UNRIC (United Nations), Yamaha, Toshiba , Nikon, Porche and a growing number of educational, voluntary and commercial organisations >200,000 users in 2010. You may be unable to load or incur the wrath of your IT department of a large organisation trying to load packages such as XAMPP or WAMP due to possible network security issues.
For graphic images if you haven't got Photshop, PaintShop Pro etc and have few funds then use Gimp and Inkscape, these Windows packages can create very sophisticated images, also at no cost. For all these Open Source programs listed above there are lots of online forum help and media files via Google.

chris_lamb · 11-09-2010, 03:32 PM

I disagree. Paypal is perfect for shared hosting.

With Paypal all parts of the transaction which need to be secure are handled by Paypal on their secure site. None of the details which are passed back to the shared host (transaction ID, amount paid, etc.) need to be kept secure as they contain no reference to the payment method and can't be used to make further transactions.

You do not need a secure website to make use of paypal.

haltonwebmaster · 11-09-2010, 05:04 PM

You are probably right Chris. But as there are packet sniffers, and the password data passing from the user over a standard network may not be encrypted as it would be via SSL, this must imply security risks. I use a lot of wireless access and having had a Joomla site hacked due to a poorly designed function by individuals using an sql injection so perhaps I am being over cautious but having a responsibility for other people's money I would rather take the best and most secure option. I discussed this issue with a site host tech advisor and was recomended SSL and a dedicated address for a commercial sit as it was the safest option but of course the providers are always interested in making as much money as possible. I paid for a Joomla paypal function (it was only a couple of £'s but have not implemented it on any site yet due to these concerns.)

haltonwebmaster · 11-09-2010, 05:21 PM

If I can confirm that Paypal would be safe for a shared host/shared user site we could perhaps try to use Paypal for the next Haltonsc masters gala. I'll ask Frank the masters gala organiser whether he would like to try it.

Your message prompted me to review paypal and came across this. Worth a read.
http://www.paypalwarning.com/paypal_wall_of_shame.
also
http://www.rockettheme.com/forum/ind...rb_v=viewtopic

Chris is entirely correct. After a message from the Joomla Easy Paypal author, as long you use Paypal only, then SSL is not needed.

chris_lamb · 11-09-2010, 08:36 PM

To reiterate - when using Paypal correctly the details that need to be kept secure (credit card details, etc.) are only ever sent to Paypal and never to the shared host. The shared host would only ever get a transaction reference and confirmation that the payment has been made.

Steve · 12-09-2010, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chris_lamb

To reiterate - when using Paypal correctly the details that need to be kept secure (credit card details, etc.) are only ever sent to Paypal and never to the shared host. The shared host would only ever get a transaction reference and confirmation that the payment has been made.

And perhaps more importantly given the comments above, passwords should usually only be entered on the paypal https site itself.

harleymathieson · 28-02-2011, 12:39 PM

Hi Technophobe.

I've had a great deal of success creating our club website (www.rasc.org.uk) using Wordpress - it is easy to use - requires almost no technical expertise with many easily adapted templates available free as well as some excellent plugins to add functionality - again requiring little or no technical expertise to instal. The primary function of our club website is to disseminate information regarding meets, news updates etc and it allows this easily and quickly. You can have multiple administrators so adding stuff isn't just down to one or two individuals.
Our members only area was about the most challenging part to get up and running, but again with a handy free plugin and an evening's fiddling it wasn't to hard.
Feedback from members and parents has been excellent.
We've talked about paypal for meet fees etc so I'd been keen to hear more about others experiences.
Another advantage is that many hosting packages offer Wordpress pre-installed, so again it keeps the technical stuff to a minimum!

Noswimdad · 28-02-2011, 09:32 PM

A number of clubs down Souf! have used:
http://www.silverfoxweb.co.uk/

Including our own. Provides a bespoke design to your specification and then a framework for managing content.

Highly recommended if you don't want to go too technical, but you always have the option to add in stuff by writing your own php/MySql scripts as required.

Check out:
Woking SC
Guildford City
Haslemere SC
Atlantis Horsham
Crawley SC
Surrey County ASA

city4nil · 01-04-2011, 01:33 PM

What would be a typical cost from silverfox web for a typical site?

noeyedear · 01-04-2011, 03:57 PM

I did create my own site with my own content management system but have decided to revamp using wordpress, bit of a no brainer really. I will configure wordpress to allow specific users, ie. coaches, membership secretaries etc. to have access to update their own areas so the site doesn't get so out of date any more. Its very out of date at the moment.

live site here : http://www.stivesbay-sc.org/
and just started on the new site a few hours ago here :-
http://saturn.servers.rbl-mer.misp.co.uk/~stivesba/

long way to go yet but I have the structure and a lot of the plugins already sorted out, just need to add pages with stuff on them (the really boring bit).

probably need to review the colors and banner image but its ok as it isi think.

Noswimdad · 02-04-2011, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tturner

What would be a typical cost from silverfox web for a typical site?

Best to ask Rachel for a quote. We didn't spend a huge amount of money on ours and have been very pleased with the result.

haltonwebmaster · 23-05-2011, 11:10 AM

A useful program for social networking sites for those with limited php/css/html template building skills is Artisteer version 3.
This program allows users to generate their own zipped template in Wordpress, Joomla, Drupal, Codechange, blogger, dotnetnuke and .asp.
It also provides some built in flash functionality.
It allows the rapid deployment in joomla of multiple templates using a free function to provide automatically switched colours and fonts making pages more inclusive, for dyslexic or visually impaired members.

31-05-2010, 09:22 PM	#1
Techno-phobe Registered User Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 6	Creating a Club Website - Advice sought! We are looking to create a website for a medium sized club, and would welcome advice. In particular we are interested in recommendations of people or firms who might do the work, or in seeing specifications that you may have put together to commission similar projects. We would also be interested in particular tips or advice on what to do or not to do. One thought gleaned from an earlier thread, is there may also be an opportunity to consider linking the need for web-hosting, with a solution to the need for authorised users to be able to access internal data, perhaps through having some club data hosted externally, but in a secure way. This would get us away from the constraints that come with storing data on a single PC, but presumably there are different pitfalls. We would welcome other people's thoughts and experience. In addition does anyone have experience of using a PayPal type facility for internal club payments such as competition fees and Club Shop. It is being offered as an add on by a firm we have spoken to. Many thanks, and please PM if you would prefer.

11-09-2010, 03:04 PM	#2
haltonwebmaster Registered User Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Liverpool Posts: 15	Paypal and website options for CMS The haltonsc website has been running using Joomla, now version 1.5, for around 8 years. (Joomla.org) Joomla is one of many Content Management social networking alternatives. All of the added haltonsc site functions, language translation, Google map addons, online training diary Endurance Log, User forum , random pictures, template, photo gallery are open source and were costless. Though there are many free joomla adaptable templates available, a template of your own can be designed and created very easily using Artisteer 2 (This costs ~£45 for the student version of the package). You can download this template designer and play with it, though when online it's not as efficient as a hand coded template design. Other Content Management main alternatives are Drupal, Wordpress , PHBB and a few others and I’m not sure how good these are. I believe that Drupal has more categories than Joomla and is more SEO (search engine) friendly. With time and expertise a site can be written in pure PHP/MYSQL/CSS, but this is a bit of a task for a novice, see book PHP and MYSQL for Dummies. Joomla has a system similar to Swimclub's that requires an email response address , though open registration can be switched off and controlled individually by the administrator. Joomla has a super administrator who can allocate admin levels, managers and registered users so that different views are available to members and a number of individuals can share the responsibility of adding articles, pictures or new functions. Joomfish is an additional function that allows pages to be portrayed in multiple languages by the click of a flag. Joomla! is a dynamic Web application because it uses a database (MySQL) to store all of the content and uses a programming language (PHP) to power its functionality. Minimal technical knowledge is needed, apart from when dealing with installation, customising or security. Recently I have been setting up another standard site at justshost.com which has online any time tech help which is significantly better than the haltonsc current host. A standard website often shares user space with other host members and it is not secure enough for Paypal . Joomla has a lowcost Paypal function but can only be used safely using the provisos below. A standard website often shares user space with other host members and it is not secure enough for Paypal . To use Paypal, 2 must additions are needed, a dedicated IP address and SSL (secure server , these sites are always prefixed with an address that reads https: rather than http: ) SSL and a dedicated IP options are always significantly more expensive and probably not for a small club. Error see later note At justhost, the domain name is free for life and currently a 5 years site hosting costs £117. A parked domain costs another £9 per added name per annum. (A Parked domain is when you type) www.anyname.co.uk or www.anyname.com and they all go to the same webpage. One is the real web address, the other a parked web address. Many of the hosts offering unlimited this and that are often Linux based but files can be up/downloaded or accessed using open source ftp programs (e.g. firefox, fireftp) Joomla can be freely downloaded and run and functions tested on a MS Windows platform ie Laptop using a Apache servers XAMPP (free) or WAMPSERVER (free). Harvard University, Macdonalds, Burger King, UNRIC (United Nations), Yamaha, Toshiba , Nikon, Porche and a growing number of educational, voluntary and commercial organisations >200,000 users in 2010. You may be unable to load or incur the wrath of your IT department of a large organisation trying to load packages such as XAMPP or WAMP due to possible network security issues. For graphic images if you haven't got Photshop, PaintShop Pro etc and have few funds then use Gimp and Inkscape, these Windows packages can create very sophisticated images, also at no cost. For all these Open Source programs listed above there are lots of online forum help and media files via Google. Last edited by haltonwebmaster; 12-09-2010 at 06:59 PM. Reason: Remove erroneous information

11-09-2010, 03:32 PM	#3
chris_lamb Registered User Join Date: Oct 2000 Posts: 2,633	I disagree. Paypal is perfect for shared hosting. With Paypal all parts of the transaction which need to be secure are handled by Paypal on their secure site. None of the details which are passed back to the shared host (transaction ID, amount paid, etc.) need to be kept secure as they contain no reference to the payment method and can't be used to make further transactions. You do not need a secure website to make use of paypal. __________________ Chris Lambert ASA South East Region Webmaster Hampshire County ASA Webmaster Unless otherwise stated, all opinions are mine and not the views of any one else. They might not even be mine - it's hard to tell.

11-09-2010, 05:04 PM	#4
haltonwebmaster Registered User Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Liverpool Posts: 15	Security and Paypal You are probably right Chris. But as there are packet sniffers, and the password data passing from the user over a standard network may not be encrypted as it would be via SSL, this must imply security risks. I use a lot of wireless access and having had a Joomla site hacked due to a poorly designed function by individuals using an sql injection so perhaps I am being over cautious but having a responsibility for other people's money I would rather take the best and most secure option. I discussed this issue with a site host tech advisor and was recomended SSL and a dedicated address for a commercial sit as it was the safest option but of course the providers are always interested in making as much money as possible. I paid for a Joomla paypal function (it was only a couple of £'s but have not implemented it on any site yet due to these concerns.)

11-09-2010, 05:21 PM	#5
haltonwebmaster Registered User Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Liverpool Posts: 15	Hi Chris Re-Paypal If I can confirm that Paypal would be safe for a shared host/shared user site we could perhaps try to use Paypal for the next Haltonsc masters gala. I'll ask Frank the masters gala organiser whether he would like to try it. Your message prompted me to review paypal and came across this. Worth a read. http://www.paypalwarning.com/paypal_wall_of_shame. also http://www.rockettheme.com/forum/ind...rb_v=viewtopic Chris is entirely correct. After a message from the Joomla Easy Paypal author, as long you use Paypal only, then SSL is not needed. Last edited by haltonwebmaster; 12-09-2010 at 06:53 PM. Reason: Correct earlier error

11-09-2010, 08:36 PM	#6
chris_lamb Registered User Join Date: Oct 2000 Posts: 2,633	To reiterate - when using Paypal correctly the details that need to be kept secure (credit card details, etc.) are only ever sent to Paypal and never to the shared host. The shared host would only ever get a transaction reference and confirmation that the payment has been made. __________________ Chris Lambert ASA South East Region Webmaster Hampshire County ASA Webmaster Unless otherwise stated, all opinions are mine and not the views of any one else. They might not even be mine - it's hard to tell.

28-02-2011, 12:39 PM	#8
harleymathieson Registered User Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 1	Hi Technophobe. I've had a great deal of success creating our club website (www.rasc.org.uk) using Wordpress - it is easy to use - requires almost no technical expertise with many easily adapted templates available free as well as some excellent plugins to add functionality - again requiring little or no technical expertise to instal. The primary function of our club website is to disseminate information regarding meets, news updates etc and it allows this easily and quickly. You can have multiple administrators so adding stuff isn't just down to one or two individuals. Our members only area was about the most challenging part to get up and running, but again with a handy free plugin and an evening's fiddling it wasn't to hard. Feedback from members and parents has been excellent. We've talked about paypal for meet fees etc so I'd been keen to hear more about others experiences. Another advantage is that many hosting packages offer Wordpress pre-installed, so again it keeps the technical stuff to a minimum! Last edited by harleymathieson; 28-02-2011 at 12:43 PM. Reason: more info

28-02-2011, 09:32 PM	#9
Noswimdad Established Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 416	A number of clubs down Souf! have used: http://www.silverfoxweb.co.uk/ Including our own. Provides a bespoke design to your specification and then a framework for managing content. Highly recommended if you don't want to go too technical, but you always have the option to add in stuff by writing your own php/MySql scripts as required. Check out: Woking SC Guildford City Haslemere SC Atlantis Horsham Crawley SC Surrey County ASA

01-04-2011, 01:33 PM	#10
city4nil Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Wigan Posts: 647	What would be a typical cost from silverfox web for a typical site?

01-04-2011, 03:57 PM	#11
noeyedear he's got nice melons Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: the cornish riviera Posts: 1,231	I did create my own site with my own content management system but have decided to revamp using wordpress, bit of a no brainer really. I will configure wordpress to allow specific users, ie. coaches, membership secretaries etc. to have access to update their own areas so the site doesn't get so out of date any more. Its very out of date at the moment. live site here : http://www.stivesbay-sc.org/ and just started on the new site a few hours ago here :- http://saturn.servers.rbl-mer.misp.co.uk/~stivesba/ long way to go yet but I have the structure and a lot of the plugins already sorted out, just need to add pages with stuff on them (the really boring bit). probably need to review the colors and banner image but its ok as it isi think. __________________ --- fortified by bitterness and sarcasm http://www.flickr.com/still_noeyedear http://fit4swimming.com

23-05-2011, 11:10 AM	#13
haltonwebmaster Registered User Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Liverpool Posts: 15	Creating web sites A useful program for social networking sites for those with limited php/css/html template building skills is Artisteer version 3. This program allows users to generate their own zipped template in Wordpress, Joomla, Drupal, Codechange, blogger, dotnetnuke and .asp. It also provides some built in flash functionality. It allows the rapid deployment in joomla of multiple templates using a free function to provide automatically switched colours and fonts making pages more inclusive, for dyslexic or visually impaired members.

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