Too few 50m pools in the South East!!

[RaoulD]

Originally Posted by Tatter

Just to take this back On-topic for a bit, is there a reason councils don't build 50m pools?
There are no 50m pools in the West Midlands (Coventry is East Midlands really) & B'ham only has one planned and that's funded by the University.

Wolverhampton has 3 great 25m pools (No, really) at Royal School, Heath Town & Bilston, so there must be a reason other than money.

For most Council's there are cost considerations as well as space restrictions in existing leisure sites. Most will also probably look at swimming facilities as part of a wider sporting provision and will therefore see a 25m pool with a sports hall and/or gym that meets the needs of different sporting groups as a better use of the space than building a 50m pool complex that purely meets the need of swimmers.

[Tatter]

^^^^^^^
Makes sense. Annoying though when they build a 25m and a 20m pool at the same site when a single pool with a boom would do the same job. Awkward layout I guess.

[Bully]

Originally Posted by awaldram

Yes the effort involved in proper 'Charge the wall' SC training is indeed harder than LC training and will burn more calories, But this exercise is Anaerobic and will do very little to improve aerobic (The use of oxygen to adequately meet energy demands during exercise via aerobic metabolism) Capacity, whereas the low intensity activity of sustained swimming that long course pool provide will.

All energy systems work together, but the intensity and type of activity will determine which system is predominant. So when training, whether it's pushing off the wall or swimming LC or SC all energy systems are being trained at the same time and being used at the same time.

[awaldram]

Originally Posted by Tatter

^^^^^^^
Makes sense. Annoying though when they build a 25m and a 20m pool at the same site when a single pool with a boom would do the same job. Awkward layout I guess.

Hopefully if it can be kept in the public eye then councils decisions would be better.

Two pools that should have been 50m and I can't for the life of me see why not (finance aside)

Southampton Quays (think the original design was 50M but Diving area carved out.

Basingstoke the ground was available but the will was missing.

They are both testament to opportunities missed.

At least we are seeing new 50m pools built now.

On big advantage from a council/swimclub point of view is a LC pool can be boomed giving valuable pool time to clubs whilst enabling public swimming to continue.

[Bully]

Originally Posted by awaldram

On big advantage from a council/swimclub point of view is a LC pool can be boomed giving valuable pool time to clubs whilst enabling public swimming to continue.

I'm not sure how much councils would benefit financially from swimming clubs who would hire the pool for training sessions. Clubs would have to have an extensive learn to swim program as well as a teaching/coaching program which would guarantee a large income for the council. You only have to visit pools during the day to see how little they are used, and overheads probably vastly outweigh the income, but I'm no expert in pool running costs

[awaldram]

Originally Posted by Bully

I'm not sure how much councils would benefit financially from swimming clubs who would hire the pool for training sessions. Clubs would have to have an extensive learn to swim program as well as a teaching/coaching program which would guarantee a large income for the council. You only have to visit pools during the day to see how little they are used, and overheads probably vastly outweigh the income, but I'm no expert in pool running costs

I think you've probably hit the nail on the head.

Just how much is the running costs of a 50m pool to a 25m pool .?

Anybody have any idea ??
LXWXD
50m = 2500000 litres
25m = 1250000 litres

[MadHighroller]

Originally Posted by Bully

All energy systems work together, but the intensity and type of activity will determine which system is predominant. So when training, whether it's pushing off the wall or swimming LC or SC all energy systems are being trained at the same time and being used at the same time.

But, there is a difference right ?

There has to be ? Each different enviroment, will alter the intensity.

(sorry if thats what you are saying) (am I being stupid ?)

Swimming LC is different to SC, different enviroment = different outcome ?

Is'nt that why some pools are called fast/slow ?

(sorry to go off topic - im interested)

[Bully]

Originally Posted by awaldram

Is that like marathon running .??

More important to run a marathon than train to run a marathon.?

A runner would not run marathons in order to train for a marathon, but I don't understand where this is linked with training LC or SC?

Originally Posted by awaldram

I think the training needs to come before the racing.

I prefer to consider racing LC as part of the development of my age group swimmers.

[awaldram]

Originally Posted by Bully

I prefer to consider racing LC as part of the development of my age group swimmers.

I understand what your saying, But surely if your using LC meets as part of your Development program then you are in effect doing a form of LC training ?

Albeit with very little control of the environment.

I think we probably have very similar views on age group/Youth swim development.

My view is all Age group/Youth competitions including nationals are for the development of future swimmers and are not the goal in themselves.

As such they should offer schedules that promote LTAD and not make a varied selection of swims impossible as the recent (now changed) schedule did.

Oops going off on one sorry

My comments on the need for LC pools for Age groups swimmers is not based on what the best coaches can get out of SC pools but more what the average club gets out of them.

I like Ambresolaire's

"Long course training is the icing on the cake for those swimmers who are well enough conditioned to be able to race long course and not fade."

That pretty much sums it up , every swimmer capable of getting advantage from LC swimming should have the opportunity to do it.

It up to the coach to decide if and when a swimmer has reached that point but up to everyone to try and make sure that opportunity is available.

[Bully]

Originally Posted by MadHighroller

But, there is a difference right ?

There has to be ? Each different enviroment, will alter the intensity.

The training session is determined by the goal/aim, so it doesn't matter whether it's training in a LC or SC pool, the end result should be the same?

Originally Posted by MadHighroller

Swimming LC is different to SC, different enviroment = different outcome ?

Training is specific, so if the session isn't achieving what you set out to achieve then you change or adapt the set until it is

Originally Posted by MadHighroller

Is'nt that why some pools are called fast/slow ?

Some pools are like swimming through mud, most LC pools are colder than SC pools, stroke rates are different in a LC to a SC pool, there are many factors to consider, but I agree with ambresolaire "training in a 50m pool, is not a magic pill".

[Bully]

Originally Posted by awaldram

I understand what your saying, But surely if your using LC meets as part of your Development program then you are in effect doing a form of LC training ?

In that way then Yes, they will learn an awful lot from racing in a 50m pool, as much if not more than they would from training in a 50m pool.
Swimmers who don't qualify for Regionals who take part in my Regional relay teams, gain a tremendous amount from the experience, and that is also part of their development

[BIGBrian]

Originally Posted by Bully

I prefer to consider racing LC as part of the development of my age group swimmers.

When you say "your" Age Group swimmers, do you mean your squad or your club? I'm sure I see some Age Group swimmers from your club training at Aldershot of a Saturday morning, but I freely admit not being familiar enough with the squad members to know how many, if any, of them are Age Group swimmers.

In which case, the approaches aren't really all that different. The only Age Group swimmers in our club who regularly train LC are those (relatively few) in the top squad who are already Regional standard at least anyway. The Age Group swimmers in the other squads get the vast majority of their LC training by competing LC.

[Bully]

Originally Posted by BIGBrian

When you say "your" Age Group swimmers, do you mean your squad or your club?

Mine as in my squad, and mine as in the club's
None of those that you see training at Aldershot on a Saturday morning or a Tuesday evening are age group swimmers, they are all youth's
I am responsible for the development of over 30 age group swimmers, who range from 10 up to and including 14 year olds from County standard up to National level, which means they will get 4 years to either hate me or love me

[chris_lamb]

Originally Posted by Bully

they will get 4 years to either hate me or love me

Does it take them that long to decide?